#6790297 - 12/24/12 04:42 PM
Re: So, I'm finally building an engine...
[Re: PsychoEBPSiR]
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ReplicaR
Post Master Sr
Registered: 05/26/06
Posts: 7097
Loc: E.E.B.
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So, no news on the mustang yet. I've moved it to a different shop, they found a few vacuum leaks, realigned the rockers, replaced distributor, and the car is waiting for a tune right now. Their laptop broke, so they have a queue of cars waiting for tune.
Meanwhile, I couldn't help myself, and got a small lip spoiler for the TSX. It was 45 dollars painted and shipped, I couldn't resist.
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#6807985 - 01/03/13 05:17 PM
Re: So, I'm finally building an engine...
[Re: ReplicaR]
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ReplicaR
Post Master Sr
Registered: 05/26/06
Posts: 7097
Loc: E.E.B.
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Well, bit of an update on the engine. So, I got the car back from the shop probably last Friday. There were some idle issues, which were not present at the dyno time, so they corrected everything for free by looking over the tune, and adding grounds next day. The car made 326whp at 5200rpm, after which the power would drop off. Torque was around 334whp mark as well. Timing is still at 29 degrees, we can’t really go much further without a risk of detonation at the track, since we are blessed with shitty 91 octane in SoCal.
Impressions: Power is good. I’ve essentially gained 120whp over what the car used to make before. The new shop made the car idle a LOT better than it used to be, drivability has increased tenfold, and power deliver is very smooth. Engine is pretty smooth as well, throughout the range of revs. Before at anything over 4k, it felt like it was going to disintegrate, but now it’s so silky, I can’t tell where I am without looking at the tach. I’ve taken the car out for a “spirited run”, with a few of my friends who have M3s and M5s. I was able to break off E39 M5 with ease, same goes for E46 M3s. Temperatures were very stable, and I was in the higher range of the revs pretty much the entire time. Brakes were affected in the negative way. Not enough vacuum, so I’m looking to HydraBoost conversion from a 96-04 Mustang.
Chasing power: The setup is not completely optimized. There is still power here and there I can pick up, but once again, it will cost me. My Edelbrock Performer 5.0 intake manifold has a range of idle to 5,500, which is why I’m dropping power at 5300 and on. It’s been ported, but only to accept a 75mm throttle body. The rest of it is still stock. I’m thinking about going to an intake manifold that supports higher rpm range to get to the rest of that power, most likely TrickFlow Track Heat. Cam is good for it, so are the heads, and so is everything else. There is still more power in timing, but we can’t go there safely without mixing gas. This could be an option in future as a flip switch tune, and I’ll just take like 12 gallons of 100 to the track with me. Another thing I should have probably added was an ignition box. Anyway, for now I’m pretty happy. Trying to make it to Buttonwillow in 4 weeks, need brakes to be finished by then.
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#6809607 - 01/04/13 11:25 AM
Re: So, I'm finally building an engine...
[Re: Impulsive]
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ReplicaR
Post Master Sr
Registered: 05/26/06
Posts: 7097
Loc: E.E.B.
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It's not really the tuning that's an issue. It's the crap gas that we have in California. The car is actually tuned really well for as much timing as it has.
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#6809703 - 01/04/13 11:53 AM
Re: So, I'm finally building an engine...
[Re: UglyValiant]
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ReplicaR
Post Master Sr
Registered: 05/26/06
Posts: 7097
Loc: E.E.B.
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Thanks, completely forgot about that one.  Bumped the handling too, since the front end is lighter, and bites harder.
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#6840072 - 01/17/13 06:08 PM
Re: So, I'm finally building an engine...
[Re: ReplicaR]
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ReplicaR
Post Master Sr
Registered: 05/26/06
Posts: 7097
Loc: E.E.B.
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So, I decided to have the car converted to Hydraboost to compensate for low vacuum from the new cam. I've had my friend's shop get hydraboost unit from a wrecked 1999 GT, and gave him the car last night. Hopefully will get the car soon, and everything is going to be groovy. I'm really looking forward to seeing how the brakes will work, especially since I never really felt like I was fully utilizing the Brembo kit that was on there. At high speed, it always felt like there is supposed to be more in there.
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#6842596 - 01/18/13 04:32 PM
Re: So, I'm finally building an engine...
[Re: stickaz_old]
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ReplicaR
Post Master Sr
Registered: 05/26/06
Posts: 7097
Loc: E.E.B.
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How much timing were you putting into it?
I'm still fairly low on timing, and that's partially because for a road race engine, it would have to operate for a lot longer intervals than a car setup for street or drag racing. My timing is still at 29 degrees, and my intake manifold is kind of a restriction, since I peak super early. I'm going to guess that there is still some power to be picked up. I'm going to go with TFS R intake manifold (2200-7200 rpm range), and possibly tune it on E85. I haven't decided if I want to do that yet, since there are only a handful of those gas stations around here.
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#6842659 - 01/18/13 05:16 PM
Re: So, I'm finally building an engine...
[Re: ReplicaR]
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stickaz_old
Post Master Supreme
Registered: 02/04/01
Posts: 56459
Loc: Nor Cal, Hella hurr durr
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or your talking about total timing? I'm out of the scene for a while, the EEC-IV puts in (n) and I put in if you look at the top right of the chart there up to 17BTDC
I'm guessing thats like ~32-34 total timing but my brain no longer remembers the total timing the EEC-4 puts in (assuming ideal temps)
but hey man power is power, don't settle for 302 performance in that thing, jmho
I had full exhaust, and the only accessories being spun were the alt, waterpump, probably everything else was bypassed AND a pretty aggressive tiny ass crank pully, so considerable 'cheating' going on
something is really, really wrong though. You're down like ~80 HP imo
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Swim->Bike->Cry "I can see that nurses head bobbing around going "I AINT CANCELIN MUH PLANS, FUCK A CDC. WHO DEY ANYWAY NAH MEEN? IMA GO SEE MUH BOO" -johnso 
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#6842700 - 01/18/13 05:40 PM
Re: So, I'm finally building an engine...
[Re: stickaz_old]
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ReplicaR
Post Master Sr
Registered: 05/26/06
Posts: 7097
Loc: E.E.B.
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I think I can find another 25 in intake manifold, and cats (yeah, I still have those). I have BBK shorties, but I don't want to go full length, so that's not going to change. I still have ALL accessories on the belt, and between 29 and 34 degrees of timing, there is a lot of power to be gained.
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#6842718 - 01/18/13 05:57 PM
Re: So, I'm finally building an engine...
[Re: ReplicaR]
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stickaz_old
Post Master Supreme
Registered: 02/04/01
Posts: 56459
Loc: Nor Cal, Hella hurr durr
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theres a 'matching' component to everything involved so careful, esp with the cam. the intake, heads, cam all have to be tuned for the same rpm window, hopefully the TFS-R intake (is that what you're going to?) doesn't actually hurt. it might. I seem to remember the old edelbrock intake being like a wunderkind intake for a baseline, see if you can find a buddy that has one, takes all of like an hour to swap
rice maths:
cats = -5
no underdrive pulley = -8
timing = -10 (??)
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Swim->Bike->Cry "I can see that nurses head bobbing around going "I AINT CANCELIN MUH PLANS, FUCK A CDC. WHO DEY ANYWAY NAH MEEN? IMA GO SEE MUH BOO" -johnso
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#6842787 - 01/18/13 06:43 PM
Re: So, I'm finally building an engine...
[Re: stickaz_old]
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ReplicaR
Post Master Sr
Registered: 05/26/06
Posts: 7097
Loc: E.E.B.
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I've talked to a few shops, and they say that I'm actually right where I should be or so. Here is the dyno graph. I'm a bit concerned with the power dropping off at 5300, where it should be pulling strong to 6500. I've made a thread on Corral, where everyone proceeded to narrow it down to either valvetrain issue or/and intake manifold being too small. I've mentioned that I do have the proper valve springs, so it's highly unlikely that I'm getting valve float, especially at such low rpm. According to dyno, there is vacuum starting to form around 4k rpm, so there is definitely room to improve on the intake manifold. It is good from idle to 5500 on a stock engine. It has been ported, but only to accept a 75mm throttle body. I think I could gain something from the intake manifold swap.
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#6849158 - 01/22/13 10:56 AM
Re: So, I'm finally building an engine...
[Re: FCobra94]
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ReplicaR
Post Master Sr
Registered: 05/26/06
Posts: 7097
Loc: E.E.B.
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Already have X-pipe and high flow cats (soon to be replaced by resonators). I've always heard that there isn't that much hp difference between the two, it was just the torque.
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#6849367 - 01/22/13 12:21 PM
Re: So, I'm finally building an engine...
[Re: Impulsive]
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ReplicaR
Post Master Sr
Registered: 05/26/06
Posts: 7097
Loc: E.E.B.
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Performer RPM is a good bit better than what I've got right now on the car. It gives you an additional 1k rpm of top end, while giving it up on the bottom. I will say though, I think I'm going to try TFS R-Series. It's been recommended by a lot of people.
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#6849885 - 01/22/13 03:41 PM
Re: So, I'm finally building an engine...
[Re: Impulsive]
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ReplicaR
Post Master Sr
Registered: 05/26/06
Posts: 7097
Loc: E.E.B.
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Here's a shootout I googled on 347's. They look to be about the same numbers wise and well matched to a 331 I'd think. Plus, you can always sell your current intake to recover much of the cost.
I think you forgot the link.
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#6850458 - 01/22/13 08:25 PM
Re: So, I'm finally building an engine...
[Re: ReplicaR]
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Impulsive
Post Master Supreme
Registered: 11/28/99
Posts: 80785
Loc: Edmonton
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#6851532 - 01/23/13 11:29 AM
Re: So, I'm finally building an engine...
[Re: Impulsive]
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ReplicaR
Post Master Sr
Registered: 05/26/06
Posts: 7097
Loc: E.E.B.
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That's so funny. That's pretty much the exact engine like I have, minus the cubes. Article says that in a fully dressed Mustang, that motor would have made 360whp, and that's on probably better gas (aka more timing), as well as long tubes, better intake manifold, and no cats. I'm not too far away from where I should be, and I am definitely looking into getting a different intake manifold at this point. Once the cats are ditched, and different intake manifold is installed, I'd really like to see a bit more range, as well as maybe crack 350whp.
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#6855153 - 01/24/13 08:12 PM
Re: So, I'm finally building an engine...
[Re: ]
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stickaz_old
Post Master Supreme
Registered: 02/04/01
Posts: 56459
Loc: Nor Cal, Hella hurr durr
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I dont think that would work at all on a mass-air electronically fuel injected car... it goes into limp mode and runs rich when air bypasses the mass-air sensor
my experience with EEC-IV controlled cars is that an intake manifold leak = instant shit power
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Swim->Bike->Cry "I can see that nurses head bobbing around going "I AINT CANCELIN MUH PLANS, FUCK A CDC. WHO DEY ANYWAY NAH MEEN? IMA GO SEE MUH BOO" -johnso
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#6899398 - 02/14/13 10:59 PM
Re: So, I'm finally building an engine...
[Re: stickaz_old]
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ReplicaR
Post Master Sr
Registered: 05/26/06
Posts: 7097
Loc: E.E.B.
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Bit of an update.
The car is currently at the shop that built the engine. The new engine is leaking oil from around the rear. Brand new engine should not leak anything, I've expressed that very clearly to the shop owner. He is taking care of it, or at least trying to. After that, I'm taking the car back to the shop that did the tune. Something has happened to it, and it's running very rich at idle, idle is unstable, and it backfires through intake on sudden throttle.
After that's done, it's going to my friend, who is going to take care of the clutch cable interference, remove the air pump along with EGR, and take care of a few loose ends around the car. I've also got rid of the small bassani cats. They weren't doing anything, and the droning inside of the car was unreal. I've replaced them with 18 inch resonators, and that changed things significantly, as far as being able to live with it.
Also, my friend posted an old photo today on facebook, as part of throwback thursdays, and it kinda inspired me to dig up an old photo, and post it too. This is from May 26th 2007. My first track day. Who would have though, I would still have the same car from then.
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#6899636 - 02/15/13 07:42 AM
Re: So, I'm finally building an engine...
[Re: ReplicaR]
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UglyValiant
Post Master Sr
Registered: 10/09/02
Posts: 6364
Loc: Milwaukee, WI
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Something has happened to it, and it's running very rich at idle, idle is unstable, and it backfires through intake on sudden throttle.
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#6900328 - 02/15/13 11:25 AM
Re: So, I'm finally building an engine...
[Re: UglyValiant]
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ReplicaR
Post Master Sr
Registered: 05/26/06
Posts: 7097
Loc: E.E.B.
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I really doubt pushrod got bent again. It happened The first week the car was running, and the hardened pushrods were replaced with chromoly. Those should be up to the job. The rockers have been relashed by the shop that did the tune, I could ask them to take a look at the rockers again, when they have it back for the tune. They are not too loud, so I'm not entirely certain that they could be loose, but it won't hurt to check, and I'll definitely mention it.
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#6918875 - 02/25/13 02:05 PM
Re: So, I'm finally building an engine...
[Re: Impulsive]
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ReplicaR
Post Master Sr
Registered: 05/26/06
Posts: 7097
Loc: E.E.B.
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Update 02/25/2013
Well another update for you guys. The car is still at the shop that built the motor. They are working on getting rid of all leaks. Since the transmission had to come out, I've told the owner to take the tranny to the transmission shop, and have all leaks fixed as well. It's been leaking a good deal as well, so now is as good of time as any to address that.
I've also planned a bit of weight loss. I've been trying to figure out what can be removed without being totally obvious, and I've decided that I will remove rear seats, rear seatbelts, rear floor mats, spare tire with jack, get lighter track wheels, and replace my reclining Sparco Torino II with non-reclining Sparco Evo. I've already bought the seats for 600 dollars for the pair this weekend, so the plan is partially in motion. I've also put a deposit on wheels at a shop nearby, so pretty soon I will have a set of Enkei RPF1 in 17x10 wrapped in 275 Nitto NT01s for the track. I've also researched what some of the parts I'm removing weight on the forums. Here is how it breaks down.
Rear seat removal: -40 lbs
Spare tire and jack: -32 lbs
Torino II to Evo swap: -30 lbs
Aluminum side mount brakets: +5 lbs
Cobra R to RPF1 wheel change: -16 lbs
Reinstall strut tower brace and K-member brace: +15 lbs
Rear floor mats: -2 lbs
At the end of the day, I'm looking at roughly 100 lbs weight saving in something that's not really all that noticeable otherwise to naked eye. 16 lbs of that will be from unsprung weight, which should make a good bit of difference in how the car responds to road surface, not to mention better sidewall action, and more tire on the ground. I will keep you guys updated with any other information. Here is the picture of the seats, from my hipstergram.
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#6920394 - 02/26/13 11:45 AM
Re: So, I'm finally building an engine...
[Re: ReplicaR]
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ReplicaR
Post Master Sr
Registered: 05/26/06
Posts: 7097
Loc: E.E.B.
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And another thing I've decided. Since the car is going back to the tune shop, for tune clean up, I said fuck it, bit the bullet, and ordered a better intake manifold. The manifold is a Trickflow R Series, which is good from 2500 to 7200 rpm. It's been recommended by pretty much everyone on the forum, requires no porting for 75mm throttle body. This should really open up top end power.
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#6920495 - 02/26/13 12:28 PM
Re: So, I'm finally building an engine...
[Re: UglyValiant]
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ReplicaR
Post Master Sr
Registered: 05/26/06
Posts: 7097
Loc: E.E.B.
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I'll leave it to them to figure out. Right now it's getting leaks fixed. After that's complete, I will take it to the shop that tuned it, and have them install the intake manifold, and tune it again, and then drive it for a couple of days to make sure all is good.
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#6926072 - 02/28/13 05:28 PM
Re: So, I'm finally building an engine...
[Re: ReplicaR]
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ReplicaR
Post Master Sr
Registered: 05/26/06
Posts: 7097
Loc: E.E.B.
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The shop called, and the leaks are fixed according to them. They've used dye this time, and found that some bolts were loose by the rear of the oil pan. The transmission was resealed as well, since it was out of the car. Picking it up today, and it's going to sit in the garage until it goes to the tuning shop for intake manifold swap, and retune.
Intake manifold arrived yesterday, and the ports look a good deal bigger. I'm pretty stoked to see what will happen now.
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