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#9031232 - 05/17/17 09:36 AM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: phoenixrage]
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Thought the 335 was a turd reliability wise.

BMW straight 6s are as reliable as Honda, at least that was my experience with my E36 m3.
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#9031279 - 05/17/17 10:01 AM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: Riskhe Business]
4age Offline
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+1 on 335 not being the best.
HPFP issues, injectors, turbo(s), carbon build up to name a few...
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#9031293 - 05/17/17 10:16 AM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: 4age]
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pheggit
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S65 M3 is the only solution.
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'07 997.1 GT3
'08 E90 M3
'11 E90 d
'02 Rota Grid - 195-55-16FR (RIP)
'04 Volk GTC - 245-35-19F/275-35-19R (Sold to a farm boi)
I thought Spark was a robot from the old movie and I kind of remember seeing him telling some engineer showing the equation for a clear metal that the guy would event years later - porschetr

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#9031322 - 05/17/17 10:38 AM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: 4age]
phoenixrage Offline
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 Originally Posted By: 4age
+1 on 335 not being the best.
HPFP issues, injectors, turbo(s), carbon build up to name a few...


Carbon build up is with any DI vehicle, imagine how bad some of the non-luxury brand cars that don't specify premium fuel. Given how many turbo BMWs there are on the road, we surprisingly don't replace turbos that often.

Issues happen with most cars, but its not like its "harder" to work on for "maintenance".
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#9031393 - 05/17/17 11:37 AM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: Riskhe Business]
87ZCSi Offline
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 Originally Posted By: Risky Business
When I impulse bought my S4, I was 90% set on the e92 m3...like I was going to get it the next day. Also a great contender and if you up your budget it would probably be the best replacement for you.

But because I daily the car I felt the S4 was the better fit for me and I kind of like the more subtle look of the S4. The e9x m3 is already a bit of a boy racerish car, still awesome though. If I had found a 4 door m3 in the specs I wanted then I would've gone that way over the s4, but those are hard to come by. Mostly coupes out there and I am not a fan.


I love the E90 M3, but, had an E90 330i and it was just too similar besides I knew I'd likely not be hauling kids around in it. The S4 is a solid choice and I leaned hard that way myself, the only reason I didn't get it was because I wanted the S65 engine since smaller FI 4's and 6's are the way of the future I wanted the NA V8 because it looks like I'll get lots of chances to own a smaller displacement FI car.

Lots of haters out there, but seriously IMO get a few more $ together and S4 or M3 are the two answers here. S4 if you care at all about economy.

/whoringituppushingM3vroomvroom
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#9031410 - 05/17/17 11:49 AM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: 87ZCSi]
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For a non daily, low mile vehicle absolutely the M3 wins. It does what it's supposed to do better than the S4. The S4 is more of the civilized compromise vehicle (still a ton of fun and easy af to drive hard).

As far as 4 vs 2 door, I feel the German made sport car segment should be repped in sedan form only. <3 sport sedans, the proportions seem to work better, but this is of course just personal opinion.

BTW, on your M3 is the seat off center to the steering wheel? I heard that's still the case (it was in my e36 m3) and it drove me insane (partially why I sold the car \:\| ).
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#9031415 - 05/17/17 11:53 AM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: Riskhe Business]
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pheggit
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Yes the seat is off Centre. BMW gay shit.

I agree with proportions working better on sedans, especially with the beefier fenders.
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'07 997.1 GT3
'08 E90 M3
'11 E90 d
'02 Rota Grid - 195-55-16FR (RIP)
'04 Volk GTC - 245-35-19F/275-35-19R (Sold to a farm boi)
I thought Spark was a robot from the old movie and I kind of remember seeing him telling some engineer showing the equation for a clear metal that the guy would event years later - porschetr

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#9031418 - 05/17/17 11:57 AM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: 4age]
Mr.Bozack Offline
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Registered: 03/24/06
Posts: 1186
Loc: Ontario
 Originally Posted By: 4age
+1 on 335 not being the best.
HPFP issues, injectors, turbo(s), carbon build up to name a few...


Also the Wastegates are known to go.

Rage all these parts cost money and because it's BMW it's more than average. I would be unhappy if every year I had to sink 3gs in a car to keep it going because "parts fail" I have no interest in a BMW turbo car...even though the 335 tempts me bigtime

Yes a M3 or S4 would be ideal, I have yet to drive either. I like the M3 more cause it's NA V8 but again BMW shit the bed with some of the oversights...Rod Bearing / Throttle Actuators / Budget brakes..I'm sure there is more but that is all that I am aware of. With a M3 I would expect everything to built to the highest standard - if I buy one I think the experience might be spoiled a bit because I would always be worried it would grenade.

I haven't heard of similar problems for the S4 - if anyone is aware please share.

I may hold onto my car for a bit longer to justify getting into one of the above cars

Edited by Mr.Bozack (05/17/17 12:08 PM)
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#9031424 - 05/17/17 12:04 PM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: Riskhe Business]
87ZCSi Offline
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Registered: 09/06/00
Posts: 7228
Loc: Portland and Toronto
S4 is a solid choice!

I've heard about this seat off center thing with the M2 and you're saying yours too. Mine... it just might be. I was going to say no until I saw the left bolster and not the right.





edit: Orange is intermediate.

Edited by 87ZCSi (05/17/17 12:05 PM)
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#9031454 - 05/17/17 12:35 PM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: 87ZCSi]
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i am ocd when it comes to that stuff, would drive me crazy.


since we are whoring our cars, I just lowered mine (less than an inch drop), did 5mm spacers and RS4 front grille

just ricer stuff, debating stage 1 tune, that 400 hp is calling my name
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#9031472 - 05/17/17 12:45 PM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: Riskhe Business]
SuPeR-MaRiO Offline
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Registered: 06/28/01
Posts: 6219
Loc: Toronto, Ontario
RB, image no worky \:\(
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#9031473 - 05/17/17 12:46 PM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: Riskhe Business]
phoenixrage Offline
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Registered: 01/15/08
Posts: 50785
Loc: People's Republic of Ontario
all i'm saying is.. if the issues were so widespread, i'd be getting more calls asking for those pricing on those parts.

Buying used is always risky since you don't know how well the previous owner treated it.
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#9031479 - 05/17/17 12:48 PM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: Mr.Bozack]
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 Originally Posted By: Mr.Bozack

I haven't heard of similar problems for the S4 - if anyone is aware please share.



hard to find high mileage reviews on the 3.0T because the DIY world is very tiny for these cars. On the forums almost everyone is a wallet mechanic. When I did my suspension last week I had to watch youtube vids in german to get the hang of it since there aren't many write ups that are even half decent.

Considering the motor is used in the Q7, A7, etc I'd go on to say that they are pretty reliable for what they are. The auto trannies are known to have issues though (mine is a 6 speed manual).

In general for your next car go NA v8 or supercharged V6.

I can't stand the power delivery on turbo cars, the twin turbo ones are decent, but still the power isn't where you want it (at least where I want it). I generally get pretty disappointed with that, I miss analog power delivery, the M3 and S4 are great at that relative something like a 335. I love the overall driving experience of the S4, won't be as raw as the 540, but it's really good for modern day standards.
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#9031503 - 05/17/17 01:02 PM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: SuPeR-MaRiO]
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 Originally Posted By: SuPeR-MaRiO
RB, image no worky \:\(



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#9031509 - 05/17/17 01:06 PM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: Mr.Bozack]
Hatorade Offline
pheggit
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Registered: 11/05/99
Posts: 26908
Loc: Toronto, ON
RB issues are overblown. Plenty of high mileage examples. As far as throttle actuators go. It is what it is, the gears/motor just wear out over time. Budget brakes? They work ok with better fluid and pads, but why do you care unless you plan to track it?

I always find it funny when ppl complain about brakes when the car is street driven.
_________________________

'07 997.1 GT3
'08 E90 M3
'11 E90 d
'02 Rota Grid - 195-55-16FR (RIP)
'04 Volk GTC - 245-35-19F/275-35-19R (Sold to a farm boi)
I thought Spark was a robot from the old movie and I kind of remember seeing him telling some engineer showing the equation for a clear metal that the guy would event years later - porschetr

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#9031644 - 05/17/17 02:14 PM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: Riskhe Business]
titty sprinkles Offline
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Registered: 08/22/05
Posts: 17318
Loc: Toronto,Ontario
 Originally Posted By: Risky Business
 Originally Posted By: SuPeR-MaRiO
RB, image no worky \:\(




shit that looks good. but i can't for the life of me understand why they chromed those mirrors.
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#9031708 - 05/17/17 02:42 PM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: titty sprinkles]
iamfob Offline
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Registered: 09/06/02
Posts: 24698
Loc: Out There
 Originally Posted By: titty sprinkles

shit that looks good. but i can't for the life of me understand why they chromed those mirrors.

Audi has been doing the chrome mirror cover on all the S3,S4,S6,S8 cars for years
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#9031775 - 05/17/17 03:00 PM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: iamfob]
87ZCSi Offline
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Registered: 09/06/00
Posts: 7228
Loc: Portland and Toronto
That looks great! Definitely do at least a stage 1 tune.
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#9031800 - 05/17/17 03:09 PM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: Hatorade]
phoenixrage Offline
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Registered: 01/15/08
Posts: 50785
Loc: People's Republic of Ontario
 Originally Posted By: Hatorade
RB issues are overblown. Plenty of high mileage examples. As far as throttle actuators go. It is what it is, the gears/motor just wear out over time. Budget brakes? They work ok with better fluid and pads, but why do you care unless you plan to track it?

I always find it funny when ppl complain about brakes when the car is street driven.


or some media outlets over exaggerate the situation. Last week on ABC, there was some report about 54 cases of BMW's catching fire while parked.

Turns out, the cases span 15 years of BMWs, and all vary from 80,000 miles to 200,000 miles. They try to imply that something is wrong with them. 54 cars out of 4.5 million BMWs on the road (given the span of 15 years of models).
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#9031805 - 05/17/17 03:10 PM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: titty sprinkles]
BroKe Offline
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Registered: 09/15/01
Posts: 3886
Loc: Markham, Ontario
My buddy just picked up a 2011 m3 sedan for 37k with 80OOOkm. Don't know what you can get with under 20? Other just picked up a 2015 civic sedan for 15k
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#9031820 - 05/17/17 03:16 PM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: phoenixrage]
Screamin' Type-R Offline
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Registered: 02/20/01
Posts: 47937
Loc: T.O. - Canaduh
 Originally Posted By: phoenixrage
 Originally Posted By: Hatorade
RB issues are overblown. Plenty of high mileage examples. As far as throttle actuators go. It is what it is, the gears/motor just wear out over time. Budget brakes? They work ok with better fluid and pads, but why do you care unless you plan to track it?

I always find it funny when ppl complain about brakes when the car is street driven.


or some media outlets over exaggerate the situation. Last week on ABC, there was some report about 54 cases of BMW's catching fire while parked.

Turns out, the cases span 15 years of BMWs, and all vary from 80,000 miles to 200,000 miles. They try to imply that something is wrong with them. 54 cars out of 4.5 million BMWs on the road (given the span of 15 years of models).


like fieros \:D lol.

a few 84's caught fire...of course that's all you 'heard' of them until they ended in '88 thanks to media and hype/thru the grapevine (non internet days). yet way more camaros caught fire over the years, but there were more produced of course.

shit even the ferrari 458, quite a few lit up (and u only heard about 1-2 of them), but it was more than that. and they had to countermeasure stupid fast for it lol.
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#9031831 - 05/17/17 03:21 PM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: 87ZCSi]
Mr.Bozack Offline
Sr Member


Registered: 03/24/06
Posts: 1186
Loc: Ontario
Rage I agree - used is a gamble for sure especially anything that is performance oriented without a service history. I'll call you and request all those parts at once \:\)

Yeah I know I would never track a car...so as long at the car stops I could care less but when they are building a track style car you think they would pay more attention to the stopping area.

I'm sure the RB issue is overblown but either way I'm sure I would be sending my oil out for analysis every year.

Risky that S4 looks great and nice job on the 6 speed. Please do the Stage 1 tune - everything I've read says it really wakes the car up. I haven't driven many turbo cars but the STI did feel fast when it came on but there was that wait and when it finally comes in you have to switch gears...reminds me of the VTEC...man I still miss that B16A2 screaming.

Watching vids in German shows the dedication to improving the ride. Luckily for me I can find plenty of vids for my project truck. 78 GMC short box stepside...I'm halfway through installing a 4/6 drop kit, gonna start the rear tonight.

Edited by Mr.Bozack (05/17/17 03:22 PM)
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#9031850 - 05/17/17 03:28 PM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: Riskhe Business]
4age Offline
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Registered: 09/11/01
Posts: 3969
Loc: North York, Ontario, Canada
 Originally Posted By: Risky Business
I generally get pretty disappointed with that, I miss analog power delivery, the M3 and S4 are great at that relative something like a 335. I love the overall driving experience of the S4, won't be as raw as the 540, but it's really good for modern day standards.


Nailed it. B8 S4 is superb for modern day standards.
It's a brilliant car and can be as dynamic as you wish - as long as you go ham with the alignment. I got that pig to drive real nice on the track - and stop real nice too (with stoptechs XD).

Motor could sound nicer though. It makes a very boring sound. Exhaust sounds nice. With a tune (Risky - you should do it), you unlock a lot of magic. The stock tune bleeds boost above 3k RPM. A tune keeps boost on, and optimizes fuel maps and spark maps. We're not talking about upping boost beyond what the motor was designed for here - we're talking about keeping the boost it was designed to work with to begin with. And with a stage 1 tune, it keeps up with an RS5 in the 1/4. Very fast, tons of torque. Transforms the car. It's nuts. S4 is the 1 car that does everything well - if that's what you're looking for.

Just buy it in a manual, and with the sport diff. The rear diff is magic.
The motor is robust as hell (mine was over-revved...as me why!), and later on had a tune on it. No problems. Motors with larger pulleys and stock internals survive season(s) of racing without rebuilds. It's solid.
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#9031867 - 05/17/17 03:36 PM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: 4age]
Mr.Bozack Offline
Sr Member


Registered: 03/24/06
Posts: 1186
Loc: Ontario
4age you have me convinced to do a tune on my future s4 if I get one.

Here's a pict I snapped this morning of my dirty rides. This is after the 4"
drop in the front.
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#9031888 - 05/17/17 03:45 PM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: Mr.Bozack]
Riskhe Business Offline
Provides a Great Work Environment.
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Registered: 05/17/10
Posts: 45654
*about to click submit on GIAC website*

takemymoney.gif
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#9031891 - 05/17/17 03:46 PM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: iamfob]
titty sprinkles Offline
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Registered: 08/22/05
Posts: 17318
Loc: Toronto,Ontario
 Originally Posted By: iambob
 Originally Posted By: titty sprinkles

shit that looks good. but i can't for the life of me understand why they chromed those mirrors.

Audi has been doing the chrome mirror cover on all the S3,S4,S6,S8 cars for years


AuDi hAS bEEn DoInG thE cHrOMe mIRrOr CovER oN alL ThE s3,s4,s6,s9 caRs fOr yEaRS



lol jk
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#9031913 - 05/17/17 03:54 PM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: 4age]
Riskhe Business Offline
Provides a Great Work Environment.
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Registered: 05/17/10
Posts: 45654
 Originally Posted By: 4age
The stock tune bleeds boost above 3k RPM.


Just curious how do you know this? source?
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#9031950 - 05/17/17 04:13 PM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: titty sprinkles]
Hatorade Offline
pheggit
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Registered: 11/05/99
Posts: 26908
Loc: Toronto, ON
Oil analysis does nothing but to make you feel better lol. Want to be proactive about the RB, do frequent oil changes (8k vs. BMW recommended 24k lmao) and swap the bearings for an aftermarket solution ($3k).

Like Phoenix said it's overblown, I never lost sleep on it. Besides you can catch it in time before it grenades.

What's up with the gay turn signals on the new audis now. They flash and do some kinda gay flash like the mustangs (mustangs look great) on the bottom row. Fucking Audi and their gay lights.
_________________________

'07 997.1 GT3
'08 E90 M3
'11 E90 d
'02 Rota Grid - 195-55-16FR (RIP)
'04 Volk GTC - 245-35-19F/275-35-19R (Sold to a farm boi)
I thought Spark was a robot from the old movie and I kind of remember seeing him telling some engineer showing the equation for a clear metal that the guy would event years later - porschetr

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#9032093 - 05/17/17 06:39 PM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: Hatorade]
87ZCSi Offline
Post Master Sr


Registered: 09/06/00
Posts: 7228
Loc: Portland and Toronto
Its a little different but ever driven a G37? I loved mine and is within budget. Can't believe I forgot about this.
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#9032128 - 05/17/17 07:16 PM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: 87ZCSi]
phoenixrage Offline
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Registered: 01/15/08
Posts: 50785
Loc: People's Republic of Ontario
if its ok to not have the latest tech/gadgets.. i'd say keep the E39 going.
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#9032149 - 05/17/17 07:39 PM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: Hatorade]
Polkaroo Offline
Jr Poster


Registered: 11/17/08
Posts: 94
Loc: Polka Dot Door
 Originally Posted By: Hatorade
Yes the seat is off Centre. BMW gay shit.

compared to 911 offset pedals?
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#9032177 - 05/17/17 08:14 PM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: Polkaroo]
Hatorade Offline
pheggit
Post Master Supreme


Registered: 11/05/99
Posts: 26908
Loc: Toronto, ON
 Originally Posted By: Polkaroo
 Originally Posted By: Hatorade
Yes the seat is off Centre. BMW gay shit.

compared to 911 offset pedals?


Ok I'll bite. Pedal offsets basically ended after 993. It was much improved with the 996 and with the 997 the only ppl that have complained about offset pedals are RHD owners. My M3 was barely noticeable with the off Centre seat, but the M2 is a fucking joke with it being off centre and crooked.
_________________________

'07 997.1 GT3
'08 E90 M3
'11 E90 d
'02 Rota Grid - 195-55-16FR (RIP)
'04 Volk GTC - 245-35-19F/275-35-19R (Sold to a farm boi)
I thought Spark was a robot from the old movie and I kind of remember seeing him telling some engineer showing the equation for a clear metal that the guy would event years later - porschetr

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#9032197 - 05/17/17 08:39 PM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: Hatorade]
Polkaroo Offline
Jr Poster


Registered: 11/17/08
Posts: 94
Loc: Polka Dot Door
I agree they improved it, but they are still offset compared to most other cars. the clutch pedal(996/997/991) lines up with the center of the driver seat.

As for the m2, never been in one. Probably overblown hype by journalists as usual.
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#9032240 - 05/17/17 09:30 PM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: Polkaroo]
titty sprinkles Offline
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Registered: 08/22/05
Posts: 17318
Loc: Toronto,Ontario
A doc at work has what wayne should have bought. hnnnnggggggg (exactly like this)
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#9032285 - 05/17/17 10:09 PM Re: Recommend me sport sedan [Re: titty sprinkles]
Hatorade Offline
pheggit
Post Master Supreme


Registered: 11/05/99
Posts: 26908
Loc: Toronto, ON
They do compare the M2 to the E36 lol

I'm going to sit in the 911 later and see where the clutch lines up.
_________________________

'07 997.1 GT3
'08 E90 M3
'11 E90 d
'02 Rota Grid - 195-55-16FR (RIP)
'04 Volk GTC - 245-35-19F/275-35-19R (Sold to a farm boi)
I thought Spark was a robot from the old movie and I kind of remember seeing him telling some engineer showing the equation for a clear metal that the guy would event years later - porschetr

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