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#8037446 - 01/08/15 02:56 PM Re: 2014 Fitness Recap [Re: Design]
Mick Daddy Offline
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Registered: 07/23/07
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alright, I see that i'm offending people, really wanted to just question benefits of lifting heavy versus regular cardio vascular training etc

Wasn't trying to make this a personal thing. I'll go back to lurking

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#8037511 - 01/08/15 03:11 PM Re: 2014 Fitness Recap [Re: Mick Daddy]
Design Offline
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No offense taken. There are going to be pros and cons of any exercise and its frequency/intensity. But everyone here agrees any exercise to get the blood moving is better than nothing at all lol.
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#8037601 - 01/08/15 03:42 PM Re: 2014 Fitness Recap [Re: 137]
dirtyS13drifta
Unregistered



 Originally Posted By: 137
 Originally Posted By: mackdiddy
The thing is, I have two grandparents that lived to be 100 and 101 year old in the mountains in jamaica, they were active into their old age. They weren't rocking back and forth in a chair or bed ridden for months, they were out walking around and still mentally fit until they passed away.


Well we're in the fitness forum talking about a recap of 2014 and not the Caribbean forum in the how to live with logentivity past 2015 thread.

So with that said I'm not sure what your point is anymore other than to create a discussion that has nothing to do with this topic or forum any longer other than to entertain you at work.

So good day!

I'd say Deisel started the detour by his comment actually.

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#8037604 - 01/08/15 03:43 PM Re: 2014 Fitness Recap [Re: Mick Daddy]
DieZel Offline
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Registered: 07/16/06
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 Originally Posted By: mackdiddy
alright, I see that i'm offending people, really wanted to just question benefits of lifting heavy versus regular cardio vascular training etc

Wasn't trying to make this a personal thing. I'll go back to lurking


no certainly no offense taken, but cardio alone is not optimal...

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#8037634 - 01/08/15 03:53 PM Re: 2014 Fitness Recap [Re: DieZel]
dirtyS13drifta
Unregistered



 Originally Posted By: DieZel
not necessarily but the 400lb bencher will likely be stronger and have better bone denisty / musculature than the 300lb bencher over the long haul, so it stands to reason it might prolong life...?

Or it stands to reason that the extra stress of training severely detriments life expectancy.

Most humans have a normal range of optimum health, and I'd say benching 400lbs is well out of that range. Same thing with ultra running and other pursuits that push the limits.

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#8037655 - 01/08/15 04:00 PM Re: 2014 Fitness Recap [Re: ]
DieZel Offline
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i think it was a comparison of 2 strength levels, and not actual numbers...

there are very few people in the population that can bench 400+lbs...

so let's compare a 200 vs 300 if we really want to do it...

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#8037691 - 01/08/15 04:26 PM Re: 2014 Fitness Recap [Re: ]
Mick Daddy Offline
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Registered: 07/23/07
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 Originally Posted By: dirtyS13drifta
 Originally Posted By: DieZel
not necessarily but the 400lb bencher will likely be stronger and have better bone denisty / musculature than the 300lb bencher over the long haul, so it stands to reason it might prolong life...?

Or it stands to reason that the extra stress of training severely detriments life expectancy.

Most humans have a normal range of optimum health, and I'd say benching 400lbs is well out of that range. Same thing with ultra running and other pursuits that push the limits.


This is kind of what I was getting at.

I have a friend that's now a professional bodybuilder, and the guy is humongous, and he's constantly talking about health and fitness. Then I thought, is bodybuilding really about living healthy (er) or is it just another obsessive vanity project.

I can't see how being extremely jacked would be beneficial in the long run.

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#8037712 - 01/08/15 04:43 PM Re: 2014 Fitness Recap [Re: Mick Daddy]
DieZel Offline
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bodybuilding vs joe public resistance training is 2 different worlds...
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#8037731 - 01/08/15 06:10 PM Re: 2014 Fitness Recap [Re: Mick Daddy]
2000SiRacer Offline
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Registered: 04/19/02
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Loc: Colorado
 Originally Posted By: mackdiddy
 Originally Posted By: dirtyS13drifta
 Originally Posted By: DieZel
not necessarily but the 400lb bencher will likely be stronger and have better bone denisty / musculature than the 300lb bencher over the long haul, so it stands to reason it might prolong life...?

Or it stands to reason that the extra stress of training severely detriments life expectancy.

Most humans have a normal range of optimum health, and I'd say benching 400lbs is well out of that range. Same thing with ultra running and other pursuits that push the limits.


This is kind of what I was getting at.

I have a friend that's now a professional bodybuilder, and the guy is humongous, and he's constantly talking about health and fitness. Then I thought, is bodybuilding really about living healthy (er) or is it just another obsessive vanity project.

I can't see how being extremely jacked would be beneficial in the long run.





I think we've decided to agree to disagree on this point.

But I'll jump into the body builder not being healthy bus. At least the top level pro guys who are taking a pharmacy's worth of drugs and on the cover of magazines at gas stations. I won't say that lifting XXX weight is somehow unhealthy or detrimental.
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#8037775 - 01/08/15 06:56 PM Re: 2014 Fitness Recap [Re: DieZel]
dirtyS13drifta
Unregistered



 Originally Posted By: DieZel
bodybuilding vs joe public resistance training is 2 different worlds...


But you snarked about people not wanting to get stronger, when asked why, you said because stronger is healthier.

If someone can 10 rep 1.5 BW, do they really need to worry about "more". Will they see any material health benefits?


Edited by dirtyS13drifta (01/08/15 06:57 PM)

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#8037787 - 01/08/15 07:09 PM Re: 2014 Fitness Recap [Re: 2000SiRacer]
Silock Moderator Offline
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 Originally Posted By: 2000SiRacer
But I'll jump into the body builder not being healthy bus. At least the top level pro guys who are taking a pharmacy's worth of drugs and on the cover of magazines at gas stations. I won't say that lifting XXX weight is somehow unhealthy or detrimental.


Sure, I'd agree with that in a heartbeat. But I'd also show evidence that ultra and marathon runners are actually at a point where they're harming themselves, too.

There's a fine line between doing enough and doing too much. I'd say most of us in this forum are pushing, if not completely over, the "doing too much" category in terms of life expectancy. However, I'd rather be doing what I'm doing and having fun than prolong my life by an extra 5 years where I'll just be sitting around drooling on myself, anyway.

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#8038015 - 01/08/15 11:09 PM Re: 2014 Fitness Recap [Re: Silock]
Mick Daddy Offline
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Registered: 07/23/07
Posts: 29167
so we agree that, the obsession with running those extra miles or lifting those extra lbs has little to do with fitness & health and more to do with just pushing yourself for the hell of it?

Cause that's all I'm asking.

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#8038082 - 01/09/15 12:12 AM Re: 2014 Fitness Recap [Re: Mick Daddy]
Silock Moderator Offline
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In terms of longevity, yes. It doesn't factor in quality of life, though.
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#8038089 - 01/09/15 12:15 AM Re: 2014 Fitness Recap [Re: Mick Daddy]
Sir Ironpool Offline
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 Originally Posted By: mackdiddy
so we agree that, the obsession with running those extra miles or lifting those extra lbs has little to do with fitness & health and more to do with just pushing yourself for the hell of it?

Cause that's all I'm asking.


There's also the mental health aspect that shouldn't be overlooked. Whether it's a goal to lift x number of pounds, or run x number of miles, they are things that bring a sense of satisfaction and joy to those doing it. Pretty sure I've seen studies that show a direct correlation between quality of life/happiness and longevity.


Edited by Mrs. Ironmom (01/09/15 12:16 AM)
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#8038090 - 01/09/15 12:16 AM Re: 2014 Fitness Recap [Re: Silock]
Sir Ironpool Offline
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 Originally Posted By: Silock
In terms of longevity, yes. It doesn't factor in quality of life, though.


Fuck, treed!
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#8038140 - 01/09/15 12:46 AM Re: 2014 Fitness Recap [Re: Sir Ironpool]
Silock Moderator Offline
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The real question is: Are the extra few years you get by taking it easy worth it if you can't move around or have bad mental health?
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#8038143 - 01/09/15 12:50 AM Re: 2014 Fitness Recap [Re: Silock]
stickaz_old Offline
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Registered: 02/04/01
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actually the converse is equally important. Is that injury risking routine/mileage/load measurably beneficial or actually harmful than a more measured approach and a more balanced life in terms of any of these things? [quality of life, health, happiness, alternate pursuits]

YMMV

CN: lift more fatso
and yes I don't do enough of anything to approach worrying about any of this stuff, but I do know what its like to compete as a college athlete
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#8038153 - 01/09/15 01:01 AM Re: 2014 Fitness Recap [Re: stickaz_old]
Silock Moderator Offline
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I think we covered that first statement already.
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#8038161 - 01/09/15 01:23 AM Re: 2014 Fitness Recap [Re: stickaz_old]
Sir Ironpool Offline
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 Originally Posted By: zakcits
actually the converse is equally important. Is that injury risking routine/mileage/load measurably beneficial or actually harmful than a more measured approach and a more balanced life in terms of any of these things? [quality of life, health, happiness, alternate pursuits]

YMMV

CN: lift more fatso
and yes I don't do enough of anything to approach worrying about any of this stuff, but I do know what its like to compete as a college athlete


Well, everybody is different. I run a lot because Ive found that my body can handle it. Because I can run a lot it allows me to pursue goals that involve...lots of running. Other people are better suited to running a 5k every weekend of the year.
The good thing with ultrarunning is that it's actually better the older you get. It's a sport where experience usually outweighs youthful exuberance and more years lived equals an ability to keep things in perspective ie. life could be a lot worse than paying someone to let you run through the woods for hours on end. \:D
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#8038264 - 01/09/15 08:02 AM Re: 2014 Fitness Recap [Re: Mick Daddy]
SJP0tato Offline
Member


Registered: 10/13/01
Posts: 814
Loc: Gilbert, Az
 Originally Posted By: mackdiddy
so we agree that, the obsession with running those extra miles or lifting those extra lbs has little to do with fitness & health and more to do with just pushing yourself for the hell of it?

Cause that's all I'm asking.


Your viewpoint is one shared by a large % of my friends/family. My wife will sometimes ask me things like "Why are you going for a bike ride this afternoon, didn't you just go running this morning?"

It's really difficult to explain it's a mixture (for me at least) of challenge, enjoyment, application of skill, and desire to improve among other things.
One person's "for the hell of it" is another person's enjoyment. \:\)

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#8038556 - 01/09/15 10:18 AM Re: 2014 Fitness Recap [Re: Silock]
dirtyS13drifta
Unregistered



 Originally Posted By: Silock
The real question is: Are the extra few years you get by taking it easy worth it if you can't move around or have bad mental health?


Depends what you mean by "taking it easy".

If I can rep 225+, and run a <6 minute mile, and run 15+ miles , and I'm happy. Then do I have "bad" health and can't move around?

I mean, really, who's more likely to have trouble moving around, someone absolutely exploring the limits of their genetics, or someone who's got far above average fitness yet is satisfied with taht.

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#8038580 - 01/09/15 10:26 AM Re: 2014 Fitness Recap [Re: ]
dirtyS13drifta
Unregistered



Some of you don't seem to get there's not only 2 options: the gym or the couch.

There's a whole spectrum of goals/ efforts. Yes, I too like to see what I can do, but what I've also found is that leads to injuries. I also see the gym as means to an end more than the end themself.
So if taking it a little easier in the gym on squats day means I have more in the tank for snowboarding, so be it.

So when someone says the equivalent of go hard/go home, I roll my eyes. Instead of belittling someone's efforts, just appreciate they're working towards THEIR goals, not yours.

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#8038645 - 01/09/15 10:57 AM Re: 2014 Fitness Recap [Re: ]
stickaz_old Offline
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Registered: 02/04/01
Posts: 56459
Loc: Nor Cal, Hella hurr durr
I think it's simply elitism/vanity/better-than-you stuff as far as I can see in this forum mainly from just one or 2 people here [no different than OT]

I'm perfectly happy being a mid-packer in noob tris and being in good enough shape to surf all day \:D

I already now how fast I can be w/20 hrs/week in the pool and 4 days/week of weight training on top and that speed has gone and ain't coming back \:D [re: all the comments about 'if u aint improving u aint doing shit' or whatever]--I'd counter if you're still improving you probably missed your competitive window by a decade or 2 with the ages of most people here imo

just as one example my PR in the 100 free [yards] was a mid 46:xx, which actually snuck into all-american one year. who cares I know... fast forward a couple decades and move workouts to random eves/mornings and maybe 3-4 hrs/week lol and I havent been able to sneak under 57:xx yet[I don't shave/taper anymore tho at least--thats probably ~2s]. As a frame of reference thats basically a solid lap behind what I used to be able to do lol

It would be a little ridiculous for me to look down on anyone doing pool workouts with goals somewhere below NCAA points or all-american designation, but this is the internet I guess

I see some people get super competitive when they get older and thats cool too I have no problem with that, but I dont really see the need to shit on others with different goals

A lot of the less vocal people here seem similar

cn: do u even lift bro? post a pic. skinnyfat
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#8038719 - 01/09/15 11:41 AM Re: 2014 Fitness Recap [Re: stickaz_old]
gamby Offline
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Registered: 11/01/99
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Some people look at cardio training as drudgery. It's something I look forward to (well, when it's outside--indoors, not so much).

Riding 40 or 50 miles on a Saturday is pretty damn gratifying to me.
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#8038731 - 01/09/15 11:47 AM Re: 2014 Fitness Recap [Re: stickaz_old]
Design Offline
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Registered: 12/11/02
Posts: 11401
Loc: The OC
In general I'd say there's very little elitism from the regulars in this forum. I think everyone likes to share their accomplishments in a crowd that can relate to the hard work it requires to do so; not because they are trying to prove their worth/performance against society. Yeah we sometime jab one another; but it's all in good fun.

I like to think I'm very encouraging of others no matter what level we're at. Maybe because I can relate from years of inactivity and related injuries. And I've always been appreciative of others who helped push me along or offer advice. Getting into triathlons, for example, was a little intimidating as I had no bike/swim experience for well over a decade. But I was fortunate to have others here volunteer their time and resources without looking down at my lack of experience or background.

Carry on.
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#8039572 - 01/09/15 11:03 PM Re: 2014 Fitness Recap [Re: ]
Silock Moderator Offline
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Registered: 01/23/00
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 Originally Posted By: dirtyS13drifta

Depends what you mean by "taking it easy".

If I can rep 225+, and run a <6 minute mile, and run 15+ miles , and I'm happy. Then do I have "bad" health and can't move around?


I don't know. Can you? There isn't a concrete thing anyone can point to. The data only shows that those who push themselves way too far end up regressing on the mortality curve. There is definitely a sweet spot. Some people may be more physically resistant to training hard than others. They train hard because their bodies allow them to. Some people train hard because they can mentally push themselves. The only real way to know is at the end of your life.

 Quote:
I mean, really, who's more likely to have trouble moving around, someone absolutely exploring the limits of their genetics, or someone who's got far above average fitness yet is satisfied with taht.


Likely? The second. That's what I meant by "taking it easy." There's a difference between running marathons every weekend or training like you're training for the Olympics when lifting and those who push themselves in the gym.

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#8039631 - 01/10/15 12:56 AM Re: 2014 Fitness Recap [Re: ]
It's Art Offline
Bitch of the Deer
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Registered: 03/01/13
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 Quote:
If I can rep 225+
You can rep 225+?

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