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#7831271 - 08/23/14 06:21 PM What's a 5D2 go for these days?
tylerdurden Offline
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After my trip to Norway and Iceland (still going through those), I basically had it with the AF on the 5D2. Even with MFA, there's just no telling exactly where the AF point grabbed unless you go to live view, which is great but works like shit outdoors during the day. Decided I needed something with an EVF and rented an A7R and bought an XT1 (with the VG, 18-55, 23, and 27), as I thought I preferred the Fuji just from fooling around with them at the store. Turns out I was wrong. It only took a few days to figure out I liked the Sony more. Both have great sensors, but the Sony is definitely the winner in terms of IQ. The shadow recovery is amazing and the noise was better too, though above about ISO 400 the shadow noise makes shadow recovery much less useful. Fuji had great color SOOC, but it wasn't anything you couldn't do in post.

Ergos on both are rather poor compared to a full size DSLR. I wish I could put the guts of the Sony in my Canon. There's just no reason to have them be so small. The strap lug on the grip side of the 7R puts it right where your shutter finger goes (which operates at least three critical buttons/switches), no idea what they were thinking. I guess I'll need a strap that attaches to the tripod plate. I got the VG for the Sony too when I bought it, otherwise your pinky just hangs off the bottom with nothing to grab on to.

While I liked the Fuji, there were things that bugged me. Auto ISO was stupid compared to even my years-old 5D2 and changing ISO requires you to press the button on the center of the dial. On the Sony, which has an auto ISO not much better, I have it set to the rear dial, which is very easy and fast to adjust. I also found the MF aids less useful on the Fuji. You have to set the magnification area before zooming, whereas the Sony lets you move it while zoomed in. I also found, despite both having basically identical pixel counts on the EVF and rear screen, focus pops really well on the Sony but not so much on the Fuji. On the Sony, I know I have focus nailed, and it's almost as quick to manually focus as it is to autofocus. Scratch that, it's faster since I have an adapter to use all my Canon lenses. AF works on all but one lens, but it's godawful slow and not particularly reliable.

I also really like the zebra feature on the Sony (rolling diagonal lines to show clipped channels), you can basically set your aperture for DOF, adjust the zebras till you don't have any clipped highlights, then adjust the ISO if needed and shoot. Recover shadows in post and it's about as close to single frame HDR as you're going to get. I love the control customization too, that's a real upgrade from the Canon. Overall I'm getting used to this body very quickly and loving the resolution and shadow detail. For the kind of shooting I do, the piss poor AF isn't an issue, and being able to preview exposure and focus in the EVF, which obviously works in any light, is a game changer. The shutter sounds like shit and the eyecup is hard as a rock and the grip is stupid small, but I love the thing. Plus, this way I get to keep all my old lenses, which I would have needed to sell to fund a Fuji system. If Canon ever pulls their head out of their ass and makes an FF with an EVF, it'll be an easy transition back.

So anyway, I have a 5D2 now that I probably won't use, but would you sell it? I think I could get a least a grand for it, but would you keep it anyway?

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#7831359 - 08/23/14 08:40 PM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: tylerdurden]
Nate047 Offline
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A7R is the same sensor as a D800. D800 has none of the ergonomic issues that the Sony has. D800 has better lens options. D800.

In case you didn't catch my drift... Get a fucking D800.

Nate
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#7831412 - 08/23/14 09:30 PM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: Nate047]
tylerdurden Offline
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Yeah, but EVF.
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#7831413 - 08/23/14 09:34 PM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: tylerdurden]
tylerdurden Offline
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Also, given the adapter situation, I'm not sure any single system has better lens options than Sony ATM.

But you're right, a proper DSLR is *much* preferable to the tiny mirrorless bodies now. And I'm not even a giant, some of these bodies might be literally unusable for those of you with sausage fingers.

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#7831516 - 08/23/14 11:20 PM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: tylerdurden]
Nate047 Offline
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They are just not usable by anyone who cares about ergonomics. It's shit. You shouldn't have to "get used" to something that bad. And yea, electronic viewfinders are cool I guess but that's not a selling point in my mind.

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#7831528 - 08/23/14 11:38 PM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: Nate047]
tylerdurden Offline
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Nailing focus every time is a selling point.

If there were an alternative, I'd look into it. But there isn't.

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#7831716 - 08/24/14 05:45 AM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: tylerdurden]
flyEX #1 Administrator Offline
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I have the exact same issues as you do. Most of the time I keep the viewfinder taped up for live view shooting. Needed AF the other day and it was a pain.

The Fuji mirrorless and A7s rustle my jimmies a little. Probably just going to wait until canon gets with it / see what is released at photokina etc.

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#7832486 - 08/24/14 10:01 PM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: flyEX #1]
tenplanescrashing
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Or you guys could just switch over to the right side with a D610 or D810 ;\)
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#7832615 - 08/25/14 12:00 AM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: tylerdurden]
Nate047 Offline
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 Originally Posted By: tylerdurden
Nailing focus every time is a selling point.

If there were an alternative, I'd look into it. But there isn't.


You're not even listening because I know you don't' want to buy new glass and spend the $$$ for a D800 or 810. But that is your alternative right there. So, "pay to play" I guess?

FWIW the D800 files are as good under work as $40,000 MFD files... Only difference being a few k pixels in dimension which 90% of the time you don't need. Unless you're shooting 50 story Apple billboards on Wilshire. And the 800E is now like $2300. Math isn't my strong point, buuuuut...

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#7832636 - 08/25/14 12:43 AM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: Nate047]
tylerdurden Offline
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 Originally Posted By: Nate047
 Originally Posted By: tylerdurden
Nailing focus every time is a selling point.

If there were an alternative, I'd look into it. But there isn't.


You're not even listening because I know you don't' want to buy new glass and spend the $$$ for a D800 or 810. But that is your alternative right there. So, "pay to play" I guess?

FWIW the D800 files are as good under work as $40,000 MFD files... Only difference being a few k pixels in dimension which 90% of the time you don't need. Unless you're shooting 50 story Apple billboards on Wilshire. And the 800E is now like $2300. Math isn't my strong point, buuuuut...

Nate


Does the 810 include telepathic AF? If not, I still very much like checking critical focus at the sensor in the viewfinder . . .

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#7833133 - 08/25/14 11:20 AM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: tylerdurden]
Sir Salty A F Offline
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I'm having a very, very hard time not pulling the trigger on an d810, a7r myself... I'd prefer the sony for the size actually. Smaller camera system for traveling and carrying in general. Just wish I didn't have to buy a $500 metabones adapter for decent lenses...
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#7834285 - 08/26/14 01:07 AM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: Sir Salty A F]
tylerdurden Offline
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It's $400, but your point still stands. I'm fine with it overall though, I'd probably lose way more than $400 selling all my lenses to switch to native E mount glass. As far as the size goes, have you spent much time with an A7? I didn't like the balance of it without the VG given that it uses FF lenses which can often have a bit of heft to them. The grip helps quite a bit.

One problem solved, BTW, a Nikon DK-19 eye cup can be stretched over the hard plastic POS the camera comes with and makes the EVF quite comfy to use. Joby strap is en route, if that works the only thing I'll have to complain about is the slow AF, which I don't really care about to be honest.

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#7841617 - 08/30/14 09:06 PM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: tylerdurden]
Sir Salty A F Offline
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I posted in the pic a day thread, but I guess it is more at home here.

Got rid of the 5d2.. Picked up the A7r with a $25 Fotodiox adapter. It's full manual, but very solid all metal with a tripod mount which helps balance the system out by changing the center of gravity on a tripod.

The downside is since my canon lenses don't have an external aperture ring, they default to wide open. My rokinon has one, so I can use all the features full manual. I might at some point spend the $$ on the metabones.. I'll play with this one for a bit.

Man, the 5d2 was soooo familiar in my hands I could basically make all my adjustments without looking at the camera. It seems like a lot of settings are buried in menus and submenus which makes adjustments a lot slower, for now.

The battery takes FOREVER to charge and seems to dissipate pretty quickly.

Can't wait to get some shutter clicks on it.



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#7841926 - 08/31/14 09:03 AM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: Sir Salty A F]
tylerdurden Offline
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Bewm. I agree that it doesn't quite feel right in the hand, the VG helps. Don't put a regular strap on it, the lug placement means if you have something attached your finger has a hard time operating the shutter and front controls. I got a Joby Pro Sling and it seems like a winner. I prefer just a hand strap, but I tried that and it really fucks up your access to the shutter.

As far as controls being where you want them, I think you'll find it pretty good once you customize everything. I have DOF preview on c1, focus peaking level to c2, zebra settings to c3 (I usually have them on but sometimes manual focus is hard with them on), and focus magnifier on AF/MF button (this one falls right under my thumb and is probably my most used button other than the shutter). I keep ISO on the rear wheel (the one around the button), some people think it's too easy to change by accident but I haven't had any trouble. Battery life is indeed not great, I have the VG though so I've got two batteries to go through. You may want to switch off the monitor and just use the EVF to save on battery if you don't get the VG. I also got a couple spare batteries and a wall charger from Amazon for $30, called Wasabi Power or something.

You're gonna love that sensor man, it really shines on the type stuff you post here. Use exposure comp and the zebras to make sure you're not clipping, adjust aperture for desired DOF, then ISO if you need to hand hold it. Bump exposure and shadows if needed in post and you have about nine stops of DR, and the noise, if you have any, is more film like than any sensor I've shot with. Pretty dope, I'm about to fly up to Banff and Jasper this morning, will hopefully have stuff to post from there and and from Iceland/Norway in the next month.

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#7841928 - 08/31/14 09:05 AM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: tylerdurden]
tylerdurden Offline
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Oh, and I see you're USB charging it. Fuck that, get the Amazon wall charger and spares, it takes hardly any time in comparison. The only thing I would use the USB for is if I had a USB battery pack and wanted to charge in the field.
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#7841959 - 08/31/14 09:48 AM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: tylerdurden]
Sir Salty A F Offline
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Cool. Yeah, a wall charger is def a must I think. I'll have to read up on how to assign buttons. I never felt the need to do that with the canon. I just skimmed the manual.
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#7841991 - 08/31/14 10:22 AM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: tylerdurden]
ewraven Offline
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Seconded on the Wasabi wall charger, I've got one for my NEX-3 and NEX-5r.

It came with two batteries. I have found that the aftermarket batteries tend to lose more charge when just sitting, they also don't last as long when in the camera.

If you decide to buy a Sony OEM battery, be careful the seller you buy it from. There are counterfeit ones out there that look pretty much identical to the OEM Sony batteries, I mean packaging and everything.

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#7842041 - 08/31/14 11:30 AM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: ewraven]
tylerdurden Offline
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Yeah, the legit Sony batteries do last longer, but at $50 a pop, I'd rather carry more of the cheap spares.

As far as assigning buttons, it is a different world from the 5D2, but in the end I like it better once everything is set up to your liking. The manual isn't very good, there are a few threads out there on A7R setup that I spent a few hours looking at. I'm still tweaking some settings, but I'm pretty happy as it sits now.

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#7842052 - 08/31/14 11:48 AM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: Sir Salty A F]
chef Offline
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Oh man custom button settings are where it's at! The downside is that I can't hand my camera to someone without explaining how to use it. Which is also usually a good thing.

It's no d800 but at least the sensor manufacturer is the same!
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#7842054 - 08/31/14 11:50 AM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: tylerdurden]
Sir Salty A F Offline
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Ok.. Found the way to assign buttons by just fiddling with it.. Yeah, the manual sucks ass. Love the instantaneous ability to verify exposure on the screen. Shooting full manual never felt so good!
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#7842056 - 08/31/14 11:51 AM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: Sir Salty A F]
Sir Salty A F Offline
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Post some of those links if you don't mind \:\)
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#7842268 - 08/31/14 04:17 PM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: tylerdurden]
scootergeek Offline
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 Originally Posted By: tylerdurden

As far as assigning buttons, it is a different world from the 5D2,


You can't reassign the buttons on the 5D2?
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#7842519 - 08/31/14 08:41 PM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: scootergeek]
tylerdurden Offline
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 Originally Posted By: scootergeek
 Originally Posted By: tylerdurden

As far as assigning buttons, it is a different world from the 5D2,


You can't reassign the buttons on the 5D2?



There are a few that you could tweak the function of, but nowhere the extent of cameras these days.

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#7842533 - 08/31/14 08:53 PM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: Sir Salty A F]
tylerdurden Offline
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 Originally Posted By: salty
Post some of those links if you don't mind \:\)


Tons of settings talk:
http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1257298

This one really introduced the power of the zebras to me:
http://www.michaelfrye.com/landscape-photography-blog/2014/04/18/sony-a7r/

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#7842546 - 08/31/14 09:03 PM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: tylerdurden]
tylerdurden Offline
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Oh, and if the hard eye cup bothers you as much as it does me, this thing is amazing:



Sorry for the cruddy pic, I'm posting from a hotel in Banff. Nikon DK-19, it just stretches over the existing hard eye cup and is deep and comfy. Cheap too. Until Sony comes out with something else (hell, maybe even if they do), this is a great ergonomic fix.

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#7842580 - 08/31/14 09:53 PM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: tylerdurden]
Sir Salty A F Offline
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Nice. So did you buy it? Your OP says you bought the xt1 and rented the sony
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#7842581 - 08/31/14 09:54 PM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: Sir Salty A F]
Sir Salty A F Offline
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And I think I'll just pack two extra batteries.. That grip takes away one of the redeeming features.. The small body.
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#7842661 - 08/31/14 11:22 PM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: Sir Salty A F]
tylerdurden Offline
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Yep. I was convinced I would like the Fuji more so I bought it and just rented the Sony to make sure I wasn't making a mistake and it didn't take very long to realize I liked the Sony more. Returned the Fuji and bought the A7R soon after with the VG and the Metabones MkIV.

As far as the VG goes, I won't try and persuade you, but I hated not having a place for my pinky and, given the Sony uses all my Canon lenses, trimming a smidge of weight isn't really noticeable. If that was my ultimate concern I'd have kept the Fuji.

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#7843032 - 09/01/14 11:47 AM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: tylerdurden]
Sir Salty A F Offline
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So I'm in Seattle and all of my pics have been OOF (remember I got the manual adapter) I just set focus peaking to high and figured when I saw red I was good to go.. Wrong. Normally when I use live view I zoom 10x to confirm focus... Took me a minute to find that setting on the sony. So with that I think I should be good to go off a tripod. I think handholding will be a crapshoot till I pony up for the metabones.
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#7843520 - 09/01/14 10:53 PM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: Sir Salty A F]
tylerdurden Offline
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Yeah, peaking is OK for smaller apertures and wider focal lengths, but it's not to be trusted IMO (it trips up on any high contrast area, whether or not it's in focus). How does the Fotodiox work with the aperture? I know I've used some non-Canon extension tubes and you select the desired aperture with the lens mounted directly on the camera, push down the DOF preview, then dismount the lens while pressing the DOF preview to get whatever aperture you wanted on the extension tube. But it doesn't seem like this would work for you as you don't have a Canon body to stop it down on anymore, not to mention that's a heinously tedious process.

I really recommend the Metabones. FWIW, I used my 24 IS at 1/8 today and it was tack sharp, which never happened on my 5D2 (IS lenses typically had a pretty poor keeper rate on that body). No idea why that would be, but it was really helpful today. Still loving my adapted A7R.

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#7843525 - 09/01/14 10:58 PM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: tylerdurden]
tylerdurden Offline
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Oh, and I recommend setting the magnifier to the AF/MF button, it falls right under your thumb. Once you hit it, the orange box pops up, and you can use the front and back wheels to rapidly move the box (one moves it up and down, the other moves it left and right, the directional arrows on the thumb wheel are slow), then hit the MF/AF button again to go to 7.2x which is where I actually confirm focus (going to the 14.4x magnification is useless IMO), then hit the shutter halfway to go back to full view again. It's a pretty quick process with some practice. Hit me up if you want some more tips!
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#7843542 - 09/01/14 11:14 PM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: tylerdurden]
scootergeek Offline
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This thread makes me want to hug my D700 and its lovely AF.
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#7843557 - 09/01/14 11:28 PM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: tylerdurden]
tylerdurden Offline
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Just checked a few from today, still amazed by the latitude of the sensor. It's fucking fantastic, and the detail without the AA filter makes me want to lick my screen. Get the Metabones dude. You're hampered without it.
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#7843559 - 09/01/14 11:30 PM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: scootergeek]
tylerdurden Offline
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 Originally Posted By: scootergeek
This thread makes me want to hug my D700 and its lovely AF.


And what about the zebras in your D700's OVF? ;\)

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#7843578 - 09/02/14 12:17 AM Re: What's a 5D2 go for these days? [Re: tylerdurden]
Sir Salty A F Offline
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Lol yeah, that's another thing.. I'm shooting wide open (f4 with that lens). I THINK I can hook it up to a canon body, set aperture (I'd go f9 for landscape) and turn off the body and it should stay at F9 on the sony.

Or I'll just buy the metabones lol.

Any issues with mirror slap?

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