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#2311312 - 02/09/08 11:09 PM Discuss: Pontiac Solstice GXP / Saturn Sky Red Line
Moof Offline
Mounts the residents
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Good stories, bad stories, story stories. I've never seen one up close before... or ever, for that matter.










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#2311327 - 02/09/08 11:22 PM Re: Discuss: Pontiac Solstice GXP / Saturn Sky Red Line [Re: Moof]
scootergeek Offline
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They look better in the pics. In person, the proportions just seem wrong. And I'm so fucking sick of high beltlines that I can't see straight - the driver's head barely clears the door metal. Better than anything Chrysler's doing.

cheers,
scott
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#2311398 - 02/10/08 12:08 AM Re: Discuss: Pontiac Solstice GXP / Saturn Sky Red Line [Re: scootergeek]
jsmonet Offline
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 Originally Posted By: scootergeek
They look better in the pics. In person, the proportions just seem wrong. And I'm so fucking sick of high beltlines that I can't see straight - the driver's head barely clears the door metal. Better than anything Chrysler's doing.

cheers,
scott


i kinda like higher beltlines, but this one's a great grandfather if i ever saw one--belt above nipples.

i'll just say +1 to the above.

i love the sky in pictures, at least
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#2311522 - 02/10/08 01:47 AM Re: Discuss: Pontiac Solstice GXP / Saturn Sky Red Line [Re: Moof]
progressi Offline
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The way they cleaned up at the Nationals this year,pretty sweet car.I dont care whether they were cheating or not,they frigging lapped the Evos.Dont get me wrong,there werent factory engineers helping things along for the poor Mitsus,but still there's potential in these things.

I think they look great,and are more manly than a Miata (Id drive one of those too,though).

The motor's supposed to be quite good (twin scroll DI Ecotech),and IIRC the suspension under it is forged alloy wishbones. I think it's got room for good sized tires too.

I heard the tops are goofy,they are big (still under 3000lbs I think) for a 2 seater,but I still dig them. Price is right too.

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#2311892 - 02/10/08 05:37 AM Re: Discuss: Pontiac Solstice GXP / Saturn Sky Red Line [Re: progressi]
Lowkeyloke Offline
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Registered: 09/17/02
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Loc: Silicon Valley, CA
For sitting so low, the sight lines are pretty good.

But the inner dash molester in me cannot get past the the absolutely shit interior that they have in there. It looks like they forgot the put the door handle in, so they cut a square hole in the (shitty) door panel plastic and called it a day.
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#2312170 - 02/10/08 11:05 AM Re: Discuss: Pontiac Solstice GXP / Saturn Sky Red Line [Re: Lowkeyloke]
PhoenixB16 Offline
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I had the pleasure of working on one of those before they even were released to the public,thanks to GM and Speedvision. Sweet lil cars( ours were race prepped with Pratt and miller cages and all the goodies)that seem to take well to a track.The Koni suspension and ZOK package springs from GM ROCK as well.Most of us had over heating issues though....Hope they fixed that one before they released em.But to us it seemed like a fun tossable car with enough grunt to make things interesting.

Edited by PhoenixB16 (02/10/08 11:06 AM)
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#2312184 - 02/10/08 11:09 AM Re: Discuss: Pontiac Solstice GXP / Saturn Sky Red Line [Re: PhoenixB16]
PhoenixB16 Offline
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Bleeding coolant in one is/was a PITA. You have to pull off one of the main coolant lines,fill the system,and then rev the engive from idle to 4k for 20 minutes,until the overflow pukes all over the LF tire \:\( It was the only way the engineers could figure it out. ha.
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#2312272 - 02/10/08 11:46 AM Re: Discuss: Pontiac Solstice GXP / Saturn Sky Red Line [Re: PhoenixB16]
LS1Formula Offline
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They couldn't find a length of tubing to run to a bucket?
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#2312290 - 02/10/08 11:53 AM Re: Discuss: Pontiac Solstice GXP / Saturn Sky Red Line [Re: LS1Formula]
PhoenixB16 Offline
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Nope. decided to let them puke all over the floor in the warehouse.(we had 10 GXP's) Talk about a slippery mess. Everyone,including the camera crew was sliding in that shit.The radiator didnt even have an actual CAP either..Bleeding those things was just utterly retarded.Oh well,we clocked some 270+ coolant temps the very next day,and the motor became a little 'limp" so to speak........

Edited by PhoenixB16 (02/10/08 11:55 AM)
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#2312404 - 02/10/08 12:47 PM Re: Discuss: Pontiac Solstice GXP / Saturn Sky Red Line [Re: PhoenixB16]
beerslurpy Offline
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270+ coolant temps? Wtf?
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#2312417 - 02/10/08 12:52 PM Re: Discuss: Pontiac Solstice GXP / Saturn Sky Red Line [Re: beerslurpy]
PhoenixB16 Offline
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Yep.There were enough complaints from us about engine temps that the engineers had us add water wetter,and better ducting around the radiator to keep constant airflow to the front of it. The AC was removed,so there was a huge pressure drop due to the removed condensor/related items.I know we hit 270ish and a few other teams hit 260+.Made things interesting when two cars had rocks thrown through the radiators and the coolant drained on track.This was at Streets last Feb-March.Hottest day we had was in the lower 90s.

Edited by PhoenixB16 (02/10/08 12:57 PM)
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#2312609 - 02/10/08 02:07 PM Re: Discuss: Pontiac Solstice GXP / Saturn Sky Red Line [Re: PhoenixB16]
skierd Offline
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You were part of the show Setup I take it?

They have the same problems the last MR-2 had, i.e. no trunk space, cramped interior, and high high high beltline. It adds an abundance of power and puts the engine out front. It also has the worst soft top this side of an early MG. I absolutely HATE the seats. If you can get past the cheap and the comfort thing, its actually a nice driving car.
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#2312761 - 02/10/08 02:59 PM Re: Discuss: Pontiac Solstice GXP / Saturn Sky Red Line [Re: skierd]
90TGP Offline
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I have an 07 GXP. Love driving the car every chance I get. With the Borgwarner K04 dual-scroll turbo, lag is almost nonexistant. Interiors are always opinionated, but I think it's a big improvement over GM interiors from 10 years ago. I mean, this is an affordable turbocharged roadster, not a Mercedes SLK. The trunk is small, but I don't go on a shopping spree at the mall, golfing, or buy a $100 worth of groceries when driving this car, I have a regular car for that. I think the seats are comfortable, I'm 5'11'' and fit fine in them. I've driven the car long distances and didn't have any problems. Although, I do think the cupholders suck. Sure, the interior might not be as nice as the Miata, Z3/4, and S2K, but those cars have been out much longer.

The only problems I have with the car is that I like the layout of the Sky interior more, and the power window switches would have been better if they were on the center console instead of the doors. That, and I don't understand why GM has to pick the stupidest bolt-patterns. It runs a 5x110 pattern, while pretty much every other car in the world runs 5x114.3. So aftermarket wheels are limited at the moment, unless you drop some money for custom made wheels.

I go to all of the local carshows and cruise-in's, and I took my GXP to all of them last summer. I couldn't beat people away from looking at it. Being new and bright red probably helped. But, I was parked next to classic cars and people would always come over to look at mine.

The base Solstice did win the SSB two years in a row at SCCA Nationals, the GXP did win the Touring2 class first time last year.

Specifications
Type: Turbocharged & Intercooled DOHC Inline-4 Ecotec; aluminum head and block.
Displacement: 2.0 Liter / 122 ci.
Fuel Injection: Direct Injection.
Turbocharger: BorgWarner Dual-Scroll K04.
Maximum Boost: 18 psi.
Valve Gear: Chain-driven double overhead cams, 4 valves per cylinder, hydraulic lifters,variable intake and exhaust valve timing (VVT).
Transmission: 5-speed automatic or 5-speed manual.
Rear Gears: 3.73 with Limited Slip.
Horsepower: 260@5300 rpm.
Torque: 260@2500 rpm.

Suspension
Front / Rear: Upper and lower control arms, coil-over Bilstein shocks, anti-roll bar.
Brakes: Front- 11.7” vented disc, ABS / Rear- 10.9” vented disc, ABS.
Wheel Size: 18 x 8” Aluminum, chrome.
Tires: Goodyear Eagle F1 245/45/18.

Dimensions
Length x Width x Height: 157.2” x 71.3” x 50.1”
Wheelbase: 95.1”
GXP Curb Weight: 2,950lbs.
Weight Distribution: 53/47 %

Performance
Lateral Acceleration: 0.88 g.
Weight to Power: 11.7 lbs. / hp.
0-60: 5.5 seconds.
Quarter Mile: 14.1@98.7 mph.

EPA Fuel Economy
22 MPG City / 29 MPG Highway.

Base Price
Solstice GXP Base Price: $26,600

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#2312765 - 02/10/08 03:00 PM Re: Discuss: Pontiac Solstice GXP / Saturn Sky Red Line [Re: 90TGP]
90TGP Offline
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By Don Keefe
High Performance Pontiac
For the '07 model year, Pontiac has seriously upped the ante in performance for the Solstice, in the form of the Solstice GXP, which debuted at the '06 Los Angeles International Auto Show. It features a turbocharged, intercooled, and direct-injected version of the familiar Ecotec four-cylinder, the first such application in a North American GM offering. This engine is tentatively rated at 260 hp at 5,300 and 260 lb-ft of torque, available from 2,000 to 5,300 rpm. This makes it GM's highest specific-output engine ever, at 2.1 hp per cubic inch of displacement (130 hp / 97 kW per liter), and the most powerful production engine in the Ecotec family. It is a high-tech wonder and really shows just how far engine development has evolved in the last several years.

IMPROVING AN ALREADY STURDY DESIGN
A lot of development work went into this new version of the Ecotec; it wasn't simply a matter of plunking a turbo on the engine. Indeed, every major casting was redesigned to provide a heightened level of reliability, though the engine was originally designed for use in forced-induction applications.

As with the new supercharged Northstar engine in the new Cadillac XLR, the displacement of the Solstice GXP's is slightly smaller than the normally aspirated version. Both feature a reduced bore size to increase cylinder-wall thickness. The Ecotec Turbo's stroke is also reduced and features a beefy, forged-steel crankshaft for additional durability. Bore and stroke are 86x86 mm (3.38x3.38 inches) for a total displacement of 1,998 cc's or 122 ci.

The Ecotec 2.0-liter Turbo uses a stronger "Gen II" Ecotec engine block, which was developed with input from racing experience to support increased horsepower and torque. Cylinder-block bulkheads -- the areas where the main bearing caps are attached -- and the cylinder walls are enlarged for strength. Other areas of the engine were enhanced to reinforce the structure, and the water jacket is deeper for added cooling capacity and improved cylinder-bore roundness. This architecture is shared with the 2.4-liter Ecotec engine that debuted in the Pontiac Solstice roadster.

Its bottom end is also upgraded to handle the additional boost. In addition to the forged-steel crankshaft, the Ecotec Turbo also employs forged connecting rods and cast pistons. The pistons feature a dish shape that deflects injected fuel toward the spark plugs. They are cooled with a jet-spray of oil on their undersides that directs the oil into a cast-in channel inside the piston, further resisting detonation.

Additionally, the Ecotec 2.0-liter Turbo four benefits from variable valve timing and an intercooled, twin-scroll turbocharger system to provide boost. A dual-scroll design is used on the exhaust turbine and speeds up velocity and response, much in the same way a two-plane intake manifold performs the identical function. The result is a nearly lag-free system, one that gives the 2.0-liter four the feel of a much larger engine. Dual cam phasing complements the turbocharging by optimizing valve timing at lower rpm for best turbo response and quick engine build-up time. "There is virtually no lag with this system," says Ed Groff, assistant chief engineer, Ecotec 2.0-liter Turbo engine. "Throttle response is immediate. The engine acts like it has a larger displacement engine."

Its turbocharger provides up to approximately 20 pounds of boost. It is matched to the engine's displacement and performance objectives, and is supported by the air-to-air intercooling system, which reduces inlet temperature pf the turbo-compressed air by approximately 212 degrees (100 degrees C), enhancing performance because cooler air is denser.

DIRECT INJECTION
Perhaps the most innovative feature of the new turbocharged Solstice powerplant is the direct injection system. Essentially, the system locates the injector in the combustion chamber rather than in the intake manifold runner or intake port. This arrangement is similar in layout to a diesel powerplant, exposing the injector to the heat and pressure of the combustion event. Unlike a diesel, the Eccotec uses a conventional spark plug and otherwise operates as a normal four-cycle spark-ignition engine. The system is referred to as Spark Ignition Direct Injection (SIDI).

With fuel delivered directly to the combustion chamber to create a more complete burn of the air/fuel mixture, less fuel is required to produce the equivalent horsepower compared to a conventional port-injection system, particularly at normal cruising speeds. "Direct-injection technology works well with turbocharging and helps deliver a great balance of power and economy," says Groff. "The Ecotec 2.0-liter Turbo produces the power expected of a V-6, but in a smaller, more efficient pacckage -- and the driving response is simply terrific."

To accomodate the direct-injection system, the Ecotec 2.0-liter Turbo has a unique cylinder head and intake manifold. The cylinder head incorporates mounting locations for the fuel injectors -- which are typically mounted in the intake ports or intake manifold on port injection engines. A high-pressure fuel pump delivers fuel to a variable-pressure fuel rail. Fuel enters the combustion chamber through multihole fuel injectors. The fuel pump, fuel-rail pressure, fuel injection timing, and injection duration are controlled by the engine control module. In this way, fuel is metered and delivered in a finely atomized spray, which, during the intake stroke, is introduced into the chamber near the intake valves, in direct line of the spark plug. SIDI also permits a slightly higher compression ratio than if the fuel were delivered with conventional fuel injection and allows the mixture to be leaner at full power.

A high-pressure, returnless fuel system is employed for this application. It features a high-strength stainless steel fuel line that feeds a variable-pressure fuel rail. Direct injection requires higher fuel pressure than conventional fuel injected engines, and an engine-driven high-pressure fuel pump is used to supply up to 2,250 psi of pressure. This system regulates lower fuel pressure at idle -- approximately 752 psi and higher pressure at wide-open throttle. The cam-driven, high-pressure pump works in conjunction with a conventional fuel tank-mounted supply pump.

Apart from the mounting position of the fuel injectors, the cylinder head has conventional port and combustion designs, although both are optimized for direct injection and high boost pressures. Sodium-filled exhaust valves and stainless steel exhaust manifold are durable components designed to stand up to the high-performance capability of the engine.

A unique cylinder head, fuel system, pistons, intake manifold, and the dual-scroll turbocharger are the olny major ccomponents that differentiate the 2.0-liter Turbo from other members of the Ecotec engine family. Mobil 1 synthetic engine oil is added at the factory. Synthetic oil was selected for its friction-reducing capabilities and high-temperature performance.

DUAL CAM PHASING
The camshafts of the Ecotec 2.0-liter Turbo engine have phasers that support the continuously variable intake and exhaust valve timing. They also have cam position sensors, so that the engine control module can accurately control valve timing. The crankshaft and camshaft position sensors are digital. A new engine controller, specific to this powerplant, is used to sense and dictate its performance parameters.

Variable intake and exhaust timing works synergistically with both the gasoline direct injection and turbocharging systems. The variable engine timing enabled by cam phasing allows the combustion process to be optimized. Also, valve "overlap" at low rpm can be adjusted by the controller to increase the response of the turbocharger, providing a more immediate feeling of power.

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#2312769 - 02/10/08 03:01 PM Re: Discuss: Pontiac Solstice GXP / Saturn Sky Red Line [Re: 90TGP]
90TGP Offline
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Another article about the turbo engine.

"Over the years, GM's Ecotec line of engines has by and large been seen as nothing more than an economical and reliable underhood offering. But with its "Gen II" revision that debuted with the 2.4L LE5 engine, GM drew upon experience racing the Ecotec engine family and built in strength to handle extra horsepower, with thickness being added to the main bearing bulkheads, cylinder bore walls, and other areas. The stage was set for a badass, forced-induction four-banger, and here we have it with the turbocharged, 260hp 2.0-liter known as the LNF.
Built for toughness, the LNF features a steel crankshaft and forged connecting rods. The pistons, while of a cast aluminum variety, feature a built-in oil galley and nifty jet-spray cooling system. We spoke to GM's Ed Groff, Assistant Chief Engineer for the LNF engine program, about this and other aspects of the design. "During development, we attached thermocouples to the pistons to allow us to analyze temperatures while the engine was in operation. Piston temperatures are a function of power level, and based on what we saw initially we decided that for the 260hp target power level, we were closer to our in-house limit than we wanted to be. This jet spray technology allows us to cool the piston by between 40 and 50 degrees C (104-122 degrees F), opening up a large safety margin for the engine."
For power, this DOHC engine features variable valve timing on both the intake and exhaust, and a "dual-scroll" turbocharger that delivers 18 psi of boost with minimal lag. This is achieved through some pretty badass technology. "We separate the exhaust passages of cylinders 1 and 4 from those of cylinders 2 and 3 all the way from the exhaust ports to where they enter the turbocharger," says Groff. "So you actually have two nozzles feeding the turbine wheel; hence the term dual-scroll. This creates somewhat stronger exhaust pulses as different cylinders are not interfering with one another as the engine goes through its firing order, which helps the turbine. Also, going off of conventional four-cylinder tuning during the valve overlap period, the cylinders are not experiencing pressure pulses coming back from the exhaust. Because of the combination of the dual-scroll and the VVT, we are able to design in a lot of valve overlap at low engine speed, which helps low-end torque."
But the real story on the LNF is gasoline direct injection, the first system of its kind offered in North America by GM. Instead of squirting fuel into the intake port upstream of the intake valves, fuel is instead injected directly into the cylinder during the intake stroke--at an amazing pressure of up to 2,250 psi. This results in superior fuel atomization and a more efficient burn. To accommodate such a SIDI (Spark Ignition Direct Injection) system, a special intake manifold, cylinder head, high-pressure mechanical fuel pump, and variable-pressure fuel rail are used. The SIDI system pays many dividends, including allowing a higher compression ratio as well as a leaner air/fuel mixture.
Also noteworthy for the LNF-equipped Sky/Solstice is that fuel efficiency is improved over the 2.4L model, with an estimated 21 city/30 highway with the manual tranny versus the standard model's 20/28. Although clearly this difference has to do in part with the 0.4-L decrease in displacement and efficient direct injection system on the Red Line/GXP's engine, it probably is also due to the fact that GM engineers cut the final drive ratio from 3.91 to 3.73 for the car's turbo version. The two models share similar axle assemblies borrowed from the Sigma platform (CTS-V), so this is at least encouraging news for Red Line owners looking to swap to a lower final drive ratio for quicker acceleration. And as if 260 hp isn't enough, look for substantial power increases on this engine in model years to come!
In addition to the advanced electronics needed to run the new SIDI system, the Red Line's new E69 ECM takes charge of other neat powertrain control functions like electronic throttle control. The ECM provides spark signals through a Quick-Sync 58x ignition system, and the cam and crankshaft position sensors are digital. Another cool feature is that despite the forced induction character of the LNF, premium gasoline is recommended, but not required. "We've tested this engine on all lower grade fuels and confirmed that the control system is able to prevent detonation," says Ed Groff. "The two knock sensors on the engine alert the ECM and it will take steps to control it, it's a computerized learning process. We've tested this engine all the way down to the 85 octane fuel you find in high elevations. But to get the full 260 hp, the engine should be operated on premium fuel."
Perhaps most interestingly, the LNF sports something that GMHTP readers know all too well: a wide-ratio (or, as we like to say, wideband) oxygen sensor. We talked to Ed Groff about why the design team chose to go this route over a conventional narrow-band unit. "The wideband is pretty uncommon in a factory application, and we use it because it gives advantages during the high level of scavenging that we use to increase the turbo response. Particularly at low speed with all the valve overlap, there can be a lot of fresh air going through the engine. So the mixture you sense in the exhaust can actually be lean while you are stoichiometric or even rich within the cylinder. We found the accuracy of the wide-ratio oxygen sensor to be beneficial in this particular application."

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#2312843 - 02/10/08 03:35 PM Re: Discuss: Pontiac Solstice GXP / Saturn Sky Red Line [Re: 90TGP]
skierd Offline
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Not to drag this back out, but there were more than a few somewhat shady dealings between SCCA and GMPP to make the Solstice legal and allow certain "performance adjustments" for the car in SSB and Touring2. Mazda was pissed enough about it (and not getting their own trunk kit approved the way GM's was) to send a letter to all SCCA and Mazdaspeed members regarding continuing its support with the SCCA. Both sides have kissed and made up, but still. Nothing against the solstice, its a very competent race car, but there's more to it than they just simply beat the competition.
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#2313305 - 02/10/08 06:51 PM Re: Discuss: Pontiac Solstice GXP / Saturn Sky Red Line [Re: skierd]
progressi Offline
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True,that's definately why I said that the car's a great car,but added that it may have had an advantage-to be fair to the Miata guys.

The jist of it was,and you probably know better than I,was that Miata "thought" they had everything submitted,but the SCCA said they didnt. It seemed like it would've been VERY important to Mazda to make absolutely sure everything was in place,rather than be suprised like they were on raceday.

Since SCCA is a mostly volunteer organization,it's hard to believe they wanted to burn Mazda,but we'll probably never know.

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#2313612 - 02/10/08 08:40 PM Re: Discuss: Pontiac Solstice GXP / Saturn Sky Red Line [Re: progressi]
NOT spotch... Offline
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I'd prefer the substantially lighter mazda with the trunk kit suspension, but considering that these were made by GM they're nothing short of miraculously awesome. Best cars GM has made in decades? (not counting the vette).
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#2313902 - 02/10/08 10:00 PM Re: Discuss: Pontiac Solstice GXP / Saturn Sky Red Line [Re: NOT spotch...]
theLoon Offline
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I can only attest to the looks of these cars, since I've only seen them, not driven. In person, the Pontiac looks worlds better than the Sky. But the much older S2000 looks better either, by a significant amount imho. Mostly has to do with the ridiculously large wheels that the dumbestics have.
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#2313939 - 02/10/08 10:08 PM Re: Discuss: Pontiac Solstice GXP / Saturn Sky Red Line [Re: theLoon]
90TGP Offline
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I like my ridiculously large 18x8 wheels with 245/45/18 tires. Try fitting those on a Miata. ;\)
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#2313960 - 02/10/08 10:13 PM Re: Discuss: Pontiac Solstice GXP / Saturn Sky Red Line [Re: 90TGP]
NOT spotch... Offline
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Registered: 07/25/00
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 Originally Posted By: 90TGP
I like my ridiculously large 18x8 wheels with 245/45/18 tires. Try fitting those on a Miata. ;\)



Meh... I kinda wish the new miatas weren't large enough to *need* 16s or 17s to look normal. Big wheels suck unless you *need* them for big brakes.

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#2314074 - 02/10/08 10:40 PM Re: Discuss: Pontiac Solstice GXP / Saturn Sky Red Line [Re: NOT spotch...]
Impulsive Offline
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I like the GM twins, but I would pick the S2000 anyways. Less comprimise from where I sit.
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#2314273 - 02/10/08 11:20 PM Re: Discuss: Pontiac Solstice GXP / Saturn Sky Red Line [Re: NOT spotch...]
skierd Offline
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Registered: 08/21/01
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 Originally Posted By: spotch
 Originally Posted By: 90TGP
I like my ridiculously large 18x8 wheels with 245/45/18 tires. Try fitting those on a Miata. ;\)



Meh... I kinda wish the new miatas weren't large enough to *need* 16s or 17s to look normal. Big wheels suck unless you *need* them for big brakes.


Its not so much the 18" as the x8" that makes it good lol. You can fit 275-285 wide tires in stock class autocross with little problem!
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#2314332 - 02/10/08 11:39 PM Re: Discuss: Pontiac Solstice GXP / Saturn Sky Red Line [Re: skierd]
NOT spotch... Offline
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Oh I know, I just hate huge wheels on most cars that aren't exotic or C5+ corvettes lol.
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#2316545 - 02/11/08 03:57 PM Re: Discuss: Pontiac Solstice GXP / Saturn Sky Red Line [Re: NOT spotch...]
Shotgun Si Offline
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Went for a ride in one my friend has. His top didn't seal properly to the passenger side window, so when driving on the freeway it was loud as hell. I think he's gotten this fixed under warranty since then, but on a 6 month old car, I wouldn't expect the roof to not fit correctly.

Also I don't like how you have to get out of the car to open the trunk, to put the top down? I think in the newer Miata's you can do it sitting in the car, one handed IIRC.

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#2316814 - 02/11/08 05:01 PM Re: Discuss: Pontiac Solstice GXP / Saturn Sky Red Line [Re: jsmonet]
Mohamed Offline
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Registered: 01/02/01
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 Originally Posted By: jsmonet
i kinda like higher beltlines, but this one's a great grandfather if i ever saw one--belt above nipples.

i'll just say +1 to the above.

i love the sky in pictures, at least

I was watching 60 Minutes last night and seeing Andy Rooney walking around the Super Bowl totally reminded me of this thread lol belt above the nipples.

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#2317440 - 02/11/08 08:00 PM Re: Discuss: Pontiac Solstice GXP / Saturn Sky Red Line [Re: Mohamed]
Lost^
Unregistered



do not want. unless i was a 40 year old woman.
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#2319983 - 02/12/08 02:17 PM Re: Discuss: Pontiac Solstice GXP / Saturn Sky Red Line [Re: skierd]
FCobra94 Offline
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Posts: 19689
Loc: MD
 Originally Posted By: skierd
Nothing against the solstice, its a very competent race car, but there's more to it than they just simply beat the competition.

Yeah, but aren't forum fan boies/current owners the only people who care to boast that kind of propaganda?

Then again, I couldn't even fit in either of them so I have no room to talk lol pun intended.
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'07 335i

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#2323417 - 02/13/08 12:07 PM Re: Discuss: Pontiac Solstice GXP / Saturn Sky Red Line [Re: skierd]
PhoenixB16 Offline
Post Master Sr


Registered: 09/11/00
Posts: 7449
Loc: mesa az usa
 Originally Posted By: skierd
You were part of the show Setup I take it?

They have the same problems the last MR-2 had, i.e. no trunk space, cramped interior, and high high high beltline. It adds an abundance of power and puts the engine out front. It also has the worst soft top this side of an early MG. I absolutely HATE the seats. If you can get past the cheap and the comfort thing, its actually a nice driving car.
Yep. Was on the RMR team.Most fun ive ever had in my life honestly. Hanging out with Tommy Kendall and Rhys for a month plus was a fucking blast.
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#8978812 - 03/20/17 09:57 PM Re: Discuss: Pontiac Solstice GXP / Saturn Sky Red Line [Re: PhoenixB16]
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#9173969 - 10/31/17 03:26 AM Re: Discuss: Pontiac Solstice GXP / Saturn Sky Red Line [Re: ]
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