need a zoom for the Mark ii *update

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#6893903 - 02/12/13 04:32 PM *need a zoom for the Mark ii update**
Sir Salty A F Sir Salty A F Post Master Supreme Registered: 01/24/12 Posts: 15608 Loc: Utah	so since i switched from Nikon to Canon, i need a new zoom. i used my 70-300mm IS on my D90 quite a bit. mostly for air shows/airport shots and motorcycles on the track... so basically panning. looking back through most of my shots it seems like i'm always at the high end.. 250mm or more. here's what i'm looking at. Canon EF 400mm f/5.6 pluses: prime, 400mm which would be nice, price, fast? because it's a prime? minuses: no IS (but for panning i usually have it turned off) f/5.6 (trying to stay under $12k lolz) Canon EF 300mm f4 IS pluses: IS, Still a prime f/4 is a little better minuses, not 400mm haha Canon EF 70-300mm f/4-5.6 IS pluses: zoom range which helps with my composition.. basically the canon version of the lens i've been using minuses: slower? Canon 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6 IS gives me some zoom and still get the 400mm reach, has IS anyone have experience here? my main concern with the primes is loosing a shot when something get's too close (moving towards me) and i can't zoom out. not sure if f4 will have a noticeable speed difference over say f/2.8 or something to warrant going with a "lower end" prime and sacrificing the zoom capabilities. Edited by salty (03/06/13 11:37 AM)
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#6893906 - 02/12/13 04:33 PM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: Sir Salty A F]
Sir Salty A F Sir Salty A F Post Master Supreme Registered: 01/24/12 Posts: 15608 Loc: Utah	if i had to pick two to narrow it down, i'd say the 400mm f/5.6 or the 100-400mm, just cause i love me some 400mm option.
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#6894127 - 02/12/13 06:02 PM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: Sir Salty A F]
flyEX #1 flyEX #1 Man in the Box Post Master Supreme Registered: 01/05/00 Posts: 26631 Loc: Down in a Hole	I have the 70-300 and it's nowhere near as good as the Nikon version I used to own. I use a 70-200 f/2.8 IS II with a 2X III extender and it's perfect for me. Out of those 4 lenses, the only one I would sort of recommend is the 100-400. The 300mm isn't going to give you the 450mm reach you are used to with the Nikon crop sensor.
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#6894470 - 02/12/13 07:56 PM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: flyEX #1]
Senor Eduardo_82 Senor Eduardo_82 miataist Post Master Supreme Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 38036 Loc: Ca�ada	I've used the 100-400, got some great shots out of it but I dislike the push-pull zoom. I own the 400 f/5.6 and have nothing but good things to say about it, understanding its limitations when it comes to available light. It's not big or heavy, but it does magnify every little twitch, movement and shake in your hands, so learn to be steady or get a monopod like I did and not have to worry about it.
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#6895078 - 02/13/13 06:49 AM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: Senor Eduardo_82]
Huggy Huggy Post Master Supreme Registered: 11/01/99 Posts: 42731 Loc: Cincinnati, OH	The Canon 70-300 is not that great and the 100-400 will destroy it. Obviously primes are great but you are stuck with no zoom. You could also do like Mike and do a 70-200 with a 2x extender, but honestly at that point I'd just take my 100-400 over my 70-200 2.8 IS II. Let me know if you want any more info on the 100-400, I absolutely love everything about mine. _________________________ Kevin - Owner and Driver of Cars -
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#6895090 - 02/13/13 07:10 AM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: Senor Eduardo_82]
Sir Salty A F Sir Salty A F Post Master Supreme Registered: 01/24/12 Posts: 15608 Loc: Utah	Originally Posted By: eddie_82 I've used the 100-400, got some great shots out of it but I dislike the push-pull zoom. I own the 400 f/5.6 and have nothing but good things to say about it, understanding its limitations when it comes to available light. It's not big or heavy, but it does magnify every little twitch, movement and shake in your hands, so learn to be steady or get a monopod like I did and not have to worry about it. good point. i forgot i've got a really nice monopod. i guess that helps. so what's this push pull zoom about? i guess just like it says. my Nikon, you twisted (just like most lenses) to zoom. what's the point of the push/pull?
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#6895091 - 02/13/13 07:11 AM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: Sir Salty A F]
Sir Salty A F Sir Salty A F Post Master Supreme Registered: 01/24/12 Posts: 15608 Loc: Utah	yeah, that 70-200 f/2.8 IS is nice but it's showing $1000 more than the other four i listed. if it was the same price i'd prob for sure jump on that one with an extender in my bag as well.
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#6895113 - 02/13/13 07:28 AM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: Sir Salty A F]
Huggy Huggy Post Master Supreme Registered: 11/01/99 Posts: 42731 Loc: Cincinnati, OH	Originally Posted By: salty Originally Posted By: eddie_82 I've used the 100-400, got some great shots out of it but I dislike the push-pull zoom. I own the 400 f/5.6 and have nothing but good things to say about it, understanding its limitations when it comes to available light. It's not big or heavy, but it does magnify every little twitch, movement and shake in your hands, so learn to be steady or get a monopod like I did and not have to worry about it. good point. i forgot i've got a really nice monopod. i guess that helps. so what's this push pull zoom about? i guess just like it says. my Nikon, you twisted (just like most lenses) to zoom. what's the point of the push/pull? The 100-400 you pull the front of the lens out to zoom in, and push it back in to zoom out. It's insanely fast to use, but can make for a long lens at the 400 side. I love it as it is insanely fast to use and simple. edit ~ here is two pics of my friend using mine: Edited by Murder (02/13/13 07:34 AM) _________________________ Kevin - Owner and Driver of Cars -
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#6895187 - 02/13/13 08:07 AM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: Huggy]
Sir Salty A F Sir Salty A F Post Master Supreme Registered: 01/24/12 Posts: 15608 Loc: Utah	i thought i've read somewhere that over time on some push/pulls the "mechanism" can wear down and the actuation becomes sloppy and loose, is this true?
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#6895273 - 02/13/13 08:47 AM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: Sir Salty A F]
Huggy Huggy Post Master Supreme Registered: 11/01/99 Posts: 42731 Loc: Cincinnati, OH	Originally Posted By: salty i thought i've read somewhere that over time on some push/pulls the "mechanism" can wear down and the actuation becomes sloppy and loose, is this true? I don't think so. I've had mine 2 years now and it has a tensioner to help prevent this. The tensioner can go from sloppy loose (like holding the camera down it will slide out to 400 on its own) to almost impossible to push or pull hard. _________________________ Kevin - Owner and Driver of Cars -
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#6895293 - 02/13/13 08:52 AM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: Sir Salty A F]
Senor Eduardo_82 Senor Eduardo_82 miataist Post Master Supreme Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 38036 Loc: Ca�ada	The 100-400 has an adjustable tension on the push-pull mechanism, so I can see it potentially wearing out over time. But standard zoom rings also tend to get sloppy over time with hard use so that doesn't say much either. I just found the 100-400 awkward to get comfortable with.
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#6896002 - 02/13/13 01:06 PM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: Senor Eduardo_82]
Lafora Lafora Post Master Sr Registered: 12/16/01 Posts: 4623	air shows and bikes? 400. Not even a question; both objects are so tiny relative to their environment I doubt you can have too much length.
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#6896005 - 02/13/13 01:06 PM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: Sir Salty A F]
Lafora Lafora Post Master Sr Registered: 12/16/01 Posts: 4623	Originally Posted By: salty i thought i've read somewhere that over time on some push/pulls the "mechanism" can wear down and the actuation becomes sloppy and loose, is this true? it has another moniker: the dust pumper
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#6896078 - 02/13/13 01:24 PM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: Lafora]
Sir Salty A F Sir Salty A F Post Master Supreme Registered: 01/24/12 Posts: 15608 Loc: Utah	Originally Posted By: Lafora Originally Posted By: salty i thought i've read somewhere that over time on some push/pulls the "mechanism" can wear down and the actuation becomes sloppy and loose, is this true? it has another moniker: the dust pumper yeah, i was just reading about that
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#6896398 - 02/13/13 02:53 PM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: Sir Salty A F]
Huggy Huggy Post Master Supreme Registered: 11/01/99 Posts: 42731 Loc: Cincinnati, OH	Originally Posted By: salty Originally Posted By: Lafora Originally Posted By: salty i thought i've read somewhere that over time on some push/pulls the "mechanism" can wear down and the actuation becomes sloppy and loose, is this true? it has another moniker: the dust pumper yeah, i was just reading about that Trust me when I say, if I haven't pumped any noticable dust into my 100-400, most probably won't either... I mean I shot with mine in basically a dust storm, lol. Maybe if you drug it through the sand... but whatever... _________________________ Kevin - Owner and Driver of Cars -
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#6896471 - 02/13/13 03:20 PM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: Huggy]
jsstritz jsstritz Post Master Supreme Registered: 02/03/03 Posts: 10994	OP have you considered Canon's 70-300L? thats my next lens for sure. i've been lusting after it for over a year now. Usually around 1500. It's fantastic quality, and 5.6 at 300. its smaller than the 100-400 and much newer technology with the 3 stop IS, etc. Someone mentioned a very good point though. Since you're used to 300mm on a CROP sensor the 300 on FF isnt gonna reach as far for you. If this is really the case then some sort of 400 might be your only option. in that case why NOT get the 100-400 so you have the range and the same max aperture as the prime? $\:\)$ Good luck! keep us posted.
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#6896479 - 02/13/13 03:23 PM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: jsstritz]
jsstritz jsstritz Post Master Supreme Registered: 02/03/03 Posts: 10994	EDIT: the 70-300L has a FOUR stop IS $\:\)$ http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/732106-USA/Canon_4426B002_EF_70_300mm_f_4_5_6L_IS.html
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#6896499 - 02/13/13 03:31 PM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: jsstritz]
Sir Salty A F Sir Salty A F Post Master Supreme Registered: 01/24/12 Posts: 15608 Loc: Utah	yeah, it's in the OP. i'm leaning towards the 400 prime lol glutton for punishment.
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#6896508 - 02/13/13 03:35 PM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: Sir Salty A F]
jsstritz jsstritz Post Master Supreme Registered: 02/03/03 Posts: 10994	call me crazy but size, weight, and same max aperture, why NOT go for the zoom then??
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#6897485 - 02/14/13 07:03 AM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: jsstritz]
Sir Salty A F Sir Salty A F Post Master Supreme Registered: 01/24/12 Posts: 15608 Loc: Utah	lol, no reason i guess.... hmmm the prime is $200 cheaper is all i got, haha
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#6898006 - 02/14/13 10:51 AM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: Sir Salty A F]
jsstritz jsstritz Post Master Supreme Registered: 02/03/03 Posts: 10994	well any will give you great IQ dude. good luck! $\:\)$
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#6898560 - 02/14/13 02:31 PM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: Sir Salty A F]
Huggy Huggy Post Master Supreme Registered: 11/01/99 Posts: 42731 Loc: Cincinnati, OH	Originally Posted By: salty lol, no reason i guess.... hmmm the prime is $200 cheaper is all i got, haha So are you going to save $200 to not have some actual zoom ability over a telephoto prime? Seems like an easy decision really. To me your choices are 400 f/5.6 or the 100-400. The 100-400 will give you tons of flexibility for a tiny bit of money extra. _________________________ Kevin - Owner and Driver of Cars -
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#6898655 - 02/14/13 03:07 PM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: Huggy]
Sir Salty A F Sir Salty A F Post Master Supreme Registered: 01/24/12 Posts: 15608 Loc: Utah	you're prob right. there's gotta be a reason for the 400mm prime, yes? or will the 100-400mm to everything just as well?
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#6898744 - 02/14/13 03:46 PM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: Sir Salty A F]
Huggy Huggy Post Master Supreme Registered: 11/01/99 Posts: 42731 Loc: Cincinnati, OH	Originally Posted By: salty you're prob right. there's gotta be a reason for the 400mm prime, yes? or will the 100-400mm to everything just as well? This took me forever to find, but it is what sold me on the 100-400 vs the 400 prime. http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=43436 The 400 is lighter, faster AF (he claims it's a rocket ship compared to the 100-400, not really as the 100-400 isn't slow by any means, but it is a little faster). I do agree with one of his opening statements, the 100-400 could only be taken from my cold dead hands. I'm not sure it would be the only one lens I'd want to have... but I love it and it would be a toss up between it or my 70-200 2.8 IS II as to what I'd want to keep if only choosing between those two. _________________________ Kevin - Owner and Driver of Cars -
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#6898769 - 02/14/13 04:00 PM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: Huggy]
Sir Salty A F Sir Salty A F Post Master Supreme Registered: 01/24/12 Posts: 15608 Loc: Utah	great read, thanks. that led me to this though lol
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#6898881 - 02/14/13 05:09 PM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: Sir Salty A F]
Huggy Huggy Post Master Supreme Registered: 11/01/99 Posts: 42731 Loc: Cincinnati, OH	Ewww yeah, f11 the 100-400 starts to fall apart... but then really, if I'm concerned at shooting at f11 in a long distance shot, the 100-400 really isn't what I'd be buying. The 100-400 to me is a great sports/air show lens. I mean are you really going to need f11 when shooting an airplane in the air... versus say 5.6-8.0 where the 100-400 holds it own and DOF will be just fine shooting a plane or racecar. If you want, I can post some airshow pics I've taken with my 100-400. Yes the 400 part is great, and sometimes I wish I had 600-800 at them, but a lot of times even 100 isn't wide enough for close flybys and shit. I don't typically have 2 cameras on me either to have 2 different lenses mounted at all times, and the push-pull of the 100-400 I can quickly and easily adapt as needed. After a few more things I'm seriously considering going to a telephoto prime like the 400... but I can tell you I'd shoot myself if I were stuck at 400 and at the same time I'd shoot myself if I couldn't get to 400 sometimes. _________________________ Kevin - Owner and Driver of Cars -
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#6899603 - 02/15/13 07:30 AM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: Huggy]
Sir Salty A F Sir Salty A F Post Master Supreme Registered: 01/24/12 Posts: 15608 Loc: Utah	well, air shows, likely not. shooting motorcycles wide open is glorious. i'd LOVE to be able to drop some coin on a large prime @ 2.8, some of the best shots i've seen have great subject isolation. here's the best my 70-300 could do... f/5.6 is all she has, but it still gives a nice subject isolation 300mm 1/400 f/5.6 ISO 100 like i said, it certainly isn't f/2.8 but it has a little of that effect.
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#6899604 - 02/15/13 07:31 AM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: Sir Salty A F]
Sir Salty A F Sir Salty A F Post Master Supreme Registered: 01/24/12 Posts: 15608 Loc: Utah	i'm thinking full frame @ 400 and f/5.6 should yield similar results??
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#6899652 - 02/15/13 07:51 AM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: Sir Salty A F]
flyEX #1 flyEX #1 Man in the Box Post Master Supreme Registered: 01/05/00 Posts: 26631 Loc: Down in a Hole	Pretty much. Look at the lens archives for yourself on POTN: 400mm f/5.6: http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=241053&page=241 100-400mm: http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=373778&page=464 Edited by flyEX #1 (02/15/13 07:53 AM) Edit Reason: added links to potn
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#6900684 - 02/15/13 01:24 PM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: flyEX #1]
Huggy Huggy Post Master Supreme Registered: 11/01/99 Posts: 42731 Loc: Cincinnati, OH	In one of hte last posts on the 100-400 post there a guy posted a picture of Roger Daltrey that is incredible beyond believe. Don't get me wrong, there are a ton of incredible pics in all the posts in POTN, but that one is one of my favorites period. _________________________ Kevin - Owner and Driver of Cars -
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#6900738 - 02/15/13 01:42 PM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: Huggy]
Huggy Huggy Post Master Supreme Registered: 11/01/99 Posts: 42731 Loc: Cincinnati, OH	Here's a few from an Air Show I went to 2 summers ago (keep in mind this was with my T1i and my editing skills were sucky-er back then): ISO100, 400mm, f/6.3, 1/500sec ISO100, 300mm, f/8, 1/1000sec ISO200, 220mm, f/8, 1/400sec ISO100, 400mm, f/6.3, 1/320sec ISO100, 235mm, f/9.0, 1/1600sec (no crop here ~ needed to shoot at 150-200mm) And one more at US Nationals with 7D and 100-400 and only the 129th picture I took with my 7D. ISO100, 330mm, f5.6, 1/500sec _________________________ Kevin - Owner and Driver of Cars -
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#6935947 - 03/06/13 11:38 AM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: Huggy]
Sir Salty A F Sir Salty A F Post Master Supreme Registered: 01/24/12 Posts: 15608 Loc: Utah	Went with the 400 f/5.6
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#6936221 - 03/06/13 12:56 PM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: Sir Salty A F]
Senor Eduardo_82 Senor Eduardo_82 miataist Post Master Supreme Registered: 01/09/03 Posts: 38036 Loc: Ca�ada	Needs a zoom. Buys a prime. $\:D$
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#6936329 - 03/06/13 01:34 PM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: Senor Eduardo_82]
flyEX #1 flyEX #1 Man in the Box Post Master Supreme Registered: 01/05/00 Posts: 26631 Loc: Down in a Hole	Thought the same thing. $\:D$ Good kill on the 400mm. Have fun with it.
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#6936388 - 03/06/13 01:57 PM Re: need a zoom for the Mark ii [Re: Senor Eduardo_82]
Sir Salty A F Sir Salty A F Post Master Supreme Registered: 01/24/12 Posts: 15608 Loc: Utah	Originally Posted By: eddie_82 Needs a zoom. Buys a prime. $\:D$ haha, yeah, i caught that when i edited it...... oh well. next one will be a prime too lolz, 135 f2
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